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Post by Karen on May 2, 2007 11:08:47 GMT -5
Smith and Jones. Of course. "You're firing us? You're the substitute teacher!" Oh dude. You really have no brains at all, do you? And then you try the "we'll all walk" thing? Never do that unless you really really know they'll all walk. 'Cuz I don't quite believe that you have as much support as you think. Ah, Veronica brings the restaurant owners to meet the kid. And it isn't magically solved. Kid isn't suddenly brought to awareness by the guy's words. He doesn't put the kid in jail either, but also sees that what Nassir did isn't illegal either. But it did "piss him off". So, he cuts off support. Which leads to the guy being grabbed by INS. Which is probably unfair, but also has the ring of truth too. And, the wife uses what he said to get him to at least meet the kid his daughter is dating. Not changing his mind yet either, but maybe there is some room to work. A bit pat in a few spots, but still reasonably true feeling. Oh, good discussion between Veronica and Keith. "It's been tough on me knowing I let you down." She sees that there are more consequences than she'd been admitting to herself. Plus, we get funny lines like "use the Mars powers for good rather than evil" and "never a stenographer around thwn you need one". But I'm thinking there's still gonna be some conflict between them over roles. I was surprised that Keith was so calm with Veronica. I suppose in his gut he must have known that Veronica might have made her friends fake IDs since he knew she made one for Josh in "Mars Bars." But as a father, finding out that your daughter was contributing to the very thing you were trying to put a stop to, well, it seems like Keith would have been a lot more upset with her. A little levity in an otherwise heavy episode. True story: Dick isn't my friend on MySpace, but Mac and Veronica are. Eetah. I saw the piece Parker handed Veronica and rolled my eyes. I loved, loved, loved Wallace's talk with Veronica. He told her how it was in no uncertain terms. But why must Veronica be with anyone right now? The girl has issues, and needs to work on them before she hooks up with someone as naive as Piz. Is he her sweetie now? What happened to Bronson? I like Mac and Max together, but this is a sudden turn of events. I know! I was all confused. Wasn't Bronson in the 'previouslies'?
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Post by Sue on May 2, 2007 11:33:07 GMT -5
I was surprised that Keith was so calm with Veronica. I suppose in his gut he must have known that Veronica might have made her friends fake IDs since he knew she made one for Josh in "Mars Bars." But as a father, finding out that your daughter was contributing to the very thing you were trying to put a stop to, well, it seems like Keith would have been a lot more upset with her. A little levity in an otherwise heavy episode. True story: Dick isn't my friend on MySpace, but Mac and Veronica are. Eetah. I saw the piece Parker handed Veronica and rolled my eyes. I loved, loved, loved Wallace's talk with Veronica. He told her how it was in no uncertain terms. But why must Veronica be with anyone right now? The girl has issues, and needs to work on them before she hooks up with someone as naive as Piz. Is he her sweetie now? What happened to Bronson? I like Mac and Max together, but this is a sudden turn of events. I know! I was all confused. Wasn't Bronson in the 'previouslies'? I wondered too, but now I think the earlier exchange with V about Bronson being all "up in the morning and out to hike and appreciate nature" guy was a tipoff that maybe he and Mac aren't destined to be "soulmates"--as they are too different. So she is then free to explore other relationships with more like-minded guys. A very broad category for the episode storylines: changing relationships---find the one that "fits." Mac: Bronson or Max Keith: shedding the free-spirited private eye persona and back into the straight-laced sherriff. Keith's deputies: learning how the new boss is different from the old boss. Keith and V: and her having to adjust to his new position/persona/attitudes V and L: allowing him to be with Parker V: exploring the option of Piz; exploring the option of getting over L. L: seeing how it looks from the other side when the ex moves on. Dick: 'nuff said and the whole terrorism/restaurant family thing was also about exploring and redefining relationships: male/female roles the husband and wife the dad and the daughter the dad and the Muslim suiter; the Jewish suiter the Arabs and the anti-Arab. And, as Lola points out really none of them yet tied up in a nice pretty package---lots of complexity and loose ends and "this is how real life works" not pat TV fiction. ============ Personal opinion, maybe I should keep my mouth shut, commentary: I expect there will be "fans" who protest that it's not the same as Season One but those are then same people who gripe that Buffy season 4 is not the same as seasons 1-3. It's interesting, thoughtful, well-written and fun to watch. I'm sorry for fans who only want to a show to be what they think it should be instead of allowing the creator to allow the characters to grow. Not that I dispute their right to dislike it and stop watching. All I'm saying is that I'm still in. Maybe it's not absolutely must see TV anymore, but in my book it's held up a lot better than some of the other "hot" shows that I've since dropped. Or, maybe not. To be honest if there are such people around I suggest they just stop watching, rather than watch and then whine. Why beat yourself and the show up? NOT directed at ANYBODY here and maybe these people don't even exist and I'm babbling so I supposed I should just shut up.
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Post by Sara on May 2, 2007 11:34:48 GMT -5
Smith and Jones. Of course. "You're firing us? You're the substitute teacher!" Oh dude. You really have no brains at all, do you? And then you try the "we'll all walk" thing? Never do that unless you really really know they'll all walk. 'Cuz I don't quite believe that you have as much support as you think. Ah, Veronica brings the restaurant owners to meet the kid. And it isn't magically solved. Kid isn't suddenly brought to awareness by the guy's words. He doesn't put the kid in jail either, but also sees that what Nassir did isn't illegal either. But it did "piss him off". So, he cuts off support. Which leads to the guy being grabbed by INS. Which is probably unfair, but also has the ring of truth too. And, the wife uses what he said to get him to at least meet the kid his daughter is dating. Not changing his mind yet either, but maybe there is some room to work. A bit pat in a few spots, but still reasonably true feeling. Oh, good discussion between Veronica and Keith. "It's been tough on me knowing I let you down." She sees that there are more consequences than she'd been admitting to herself. Plus, we get funny lines like "use the Mars powers for good rather than evil" and "never a stenographer around thwn you need one". But I'm thinking there's still gonna be some conflict between them over roles. Dick. What else can I say. Heh! The couch is her "emotional foxhole". ;D Awwww, a photo cake. Logan actually does seem to gravitate to girls/women who are . . . . genuinely nice. OK, that was too cliche. Getting a slice with Logan's face? Um. One of the rare mis-steps in writing.Logan and Dick are like a warped Abbot and Costello . . . "Doublemint, dude!" "They're becoming twins?" "What? I don't have time for this! . . . Do we have any peanut oil?" "Here? In the room?" And of course they were torturing you, Dick. Do you really think these schemes of yours will ever actually work? Oh, Veronica. You are soooo dumb sometimes. Yes!! Wallace tells her what the hell is going on. "What you're doing is cruel." "Be a good person. Just put him out of his misery." Oooh, and Piz steps up! "I went all in." And Veronica is . . . intrigued. So of course they're kissing when the elevator opens on Logan. Because, we must have angst! Torment! Relationship complextity at all cost! ;D On the other hand, how cute were Mac and her sweetie? Bonding over their mutual histories of not-so-legal scams. ;D Whatever do you mean by that...?
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Post by Michelle on May 2, 2007 11:39:44 GMT -5
Smith and Jones. Of course. "You're firing us? You're the substitute teacher!" Oh dude. You really have no brains at all, do you? And then you try the "we'll all walk" thing? Never do that unless you really really know they'll all walk. 'Cuz I don't quite believe that you have as much support as you think. Ah, Veronica brings the restaurant owners to meet the kid. And it isn't magically solved. Kid isn't suddenly brought to awareness by the guy's words. He doesn't put the kid in jail either, but also sees that what Nassir did isn't illegal either. But it did "piss him off". So, he cuts off support. Which leads to the guy being grabbed by INS. Which is probably unfair, but also has the ring of truth too. And, the wife uses what he said to get him to at least meet the kid his daughter is dating. Not changing his mind yet either, but maybe there is some room to work. A bit pat in a few spots, but still reasonably true feeling. Oh, good discussion between Veronica and Keith. "It's been tough on me knowing I let you down." She sees that there are more consequences than she'd been admitting to herself. Plus, we get funny lines like "use the Mars powers for good rather than evil" and "never a stenographer around thwn you need one". But I'm thinking there's still gonna be some conflict between them over roles. Dick. What else can I say. Heh! The couch is her "emotional foxhole". ;D Awwww, a photo cake. Logan actually does seem to gravitate to girls/women who are . . . . genuinely nice. OK, that was too cliche. Getting a slice with Logan's face? Um. One of the rare mis-steps in writing.Logan and Dick are like a warped Abbot and Costello . . . "Doublemint, dude!" "They're becoming twins?" "What? I don't have time for this! . . . Do we have any peanut oil?" "Here? In the room?" And of course they were torturing you, Dick. Do you really think these schemes of yours will ever actually work? Oh, Veronica. You are soooo dumb sometimes. Yes!! Wallace tells her what the hell is going on. "What you're doing is cruel." "Be a good person. Just put him out of his misery." Oooh, and Piz steps up! "I went all in." And Veronica is . . . intrigued. So of course they're kissing when the elevator opens on Logan. Because, we must have angst! Torment! Relationship complextity at all cost! ;D On the other hand, how cute were Mac and her sweetie? Bonding over their mutual histories of not-so-legal scams. ;D Whatever do you mean by that...? Could it mean: You can't have your cake and eat it too?
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Post by Michelle on May 2, 2007 11:55:34 GMT -5
I know! I was all confused. Wasn't Bronson in the 'previouslies'? I wondered too, but now I think the earlier exchange with V about Bronson being all "up in the morning and out to hike and appreciate nature" guy was a tipoff that maybe he and Mac aren't destined to be "soulmates"--as they are too different. So she is then free to explore other relationships with more like-minded guys. A very broad category for the episode storylines: changing relationships---find the one that "fits." Mac: Bronson or Max Keith: shedding the free-spirited private eye persona and back into the straight-laced sherriff. Keith's deputies: learning how the new boss is different from the old boss. Keith and V: and her having to adjust to his new position/persona/attitudes V and L: allowing him to be with Parker V: exploring the option of Piz; exploring the option of getting over L. L: seeing how it looks from the other side when the ex moves on. Dick: 'nuff said and the whole terrorism/restaurant family thing was also about exploring and redefining relationships: male/female roles the husband and wife the dad and the daughter the dad and the Muslim suiter; the Jewish suiter the Arabs and the anti-Arab. And, as Lola points out really none of them yet tied up in a nice pretty package---lots of complexity and loose ends and "this is how real life works" not pat TV fiction. ============ Hey....didn't you used to write VM reviews??? I love your observations!!! No, please do NOT shut up! I want to read your opinion on this. I can see both sides, honestly. I obviously still like the show, and love to read what others think about it. I volunteered to help Spring write the reviews because I wanted to do my part to continue encouraging discussion. But what I've discovered is that fandom can be a two-edged sword. When the fandom loves a show, they LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE a show. They write fanfic, they make videos, they post reviews, and heck, they even rent a plane to fly a banner asking the PTB to renew the show. That is some dedication. So then, when a show starts changing in a way that doesn't seem true to the characters, or story lines are perceived to be written almost in retaliation against certain fans, well, fandom implodes. And then explodes, and then implodes again. It's a very interesting phenomenon, I must say. But yeah, why don't they just stop watching? Well, based on the ratings, many of them have.
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 13:06:39 GMT -5
So are we going from LoVe to ....umm .... Viz? Pizica? Pizonica? I like Viz. I like the episode well enough. I wish they would not have had Logan on the elevator when the door opened to them kissing. I am not a LoVe shipper, but I am not going all Viz shipper yet either, the jury is still out for me. Heee! I like Viz, but Pizonica is snappy too. Having Logan see them as the elevator doors opened was a bit over the top, not 'cuz of Veronica/Logan shipper stuff for me, but because it's a bit . . . well, over the top. Then again, they are at his place, his party, so duh. I guess it was sort of given that they'd be seen. (I'm in my usual slasher place of having a pairing that I like better that will never happen on screen, but being fine with either of the pairings they actually have on screen. ;D ) Piz is cute and nice, so it may work. Interesting to note that both Logan and Veronica have gotten together with, well, nice people. Uncomplicated (as far as we know right now, and as uncomplicated as it's possible to get on VM) nice people. Which, with their own screwed up relationship issues, might be just what they need. But will it be enough? Guess we'll see.
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 13:13:12 GMT -5
Smith and Jones. Of course. "You're firing us? You're the substitute teacher!" Oh dude. You really have no brains at all, do you? And then you try the "we'll all walk" thing? Never do that unless you really really know they'll all walk. 'Cuz I don't quite believe that you have as much support as you think. Ah, Veronica brings the restaurant owners to meet the kid. And it isn't magically solved. Kid isn't suddenly brought to awareness by the guy's words. He doesn't put the kid in jail either, but also sees that what Nassir did isn't illegal either. But it did "piss him off". So, he cuts off support. Which leads to the guy being grabbed by INS. Which is probably unfair, but also has the ring of truth too. And, the wife uses what he said to get him to at least meet the kid his daughter is dating. Not changing his mind yet either, but maybe there is some room to work. A bit pat in a few spots, but still reasonably true feeling. Oh, good discussion between Veronica and Keith. "It's been tough on me knowing I let you down." She sees that there are more consequences than she'd been admitting to herself. Plus, we get funny lines like "use the Mars powers for good rather than evil" and "never a stenographer around thwn you need one". But I'm thinking there's still gonna be some conflict between them over roles. I was surprised that Keith was so calm with Veronica. I suppose in his gut he must have known that Veronica might have made her friends fake IDs since he knew she made one for Josh in "Mars Bars." But as a father, finding out that your daughter was contributing to the very thing you were trying to put a stop to, well, it seems like Keith would have been a lot more upset with her. A little levity in an otherwise heavy episode. True story: Dick isn't my friend on MySpace, but Mac and Veronica are. ;D Totally, dude! Just too heavy handed. Plus, I don't believe for one minute that Parker wasn't watching what she was doing and that she'd never have handed over that piece of cake. Certainly not to Veronica. Very much loved Wallace's talk. He's always the one that can make her snap out of her own inner world and look around at what's going on with other people. I'm not sure Piz and her will work out long term either. They'll certainly have things to work on. And yeah, I think she should spend a bit of time on her own, but then again, that's the kind of good solid advice someone else always gives you and that you usually never take. ;D So not unusual for anyone to fall into that "I'm not with someone, everyone else is, man this sucks" kind of thinking. Is he her sweetie now? What happened to Bronson? I like Mac and Max together, but this is a sudden turn of events. [/quote] Well, I guess I was making assumptions there, wasn't I? It looked like they were getting along and I leapt to conclusions. Plus, I probably got them confuzzled in my mind. ;D
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 13:14:24 GMT -5
I was surprised that Keith was so calm with Veronica. I suppose in his gut he must have known that Veronica might have made her friends fake IDs since he knew she made one for Josh in "Mars Bars." But as a father, finding out that your daughter was contributing to the very thing you were trying to put a stop to, well, it seems like Keith would have been a lot more upset with her. A little levity in an otherwise heavy episode. True story: Dick isn't my friend on MySpace, but Mac and Veronica are. Eetah. I saw the piece Parker handed Veronica and rolled my eyes. I loved, loved, loved Wallace's talk with Veronica. He told her how it was in no uncertain terms. But why must Veronica be with anyone right now? The girl has issues, and needs to work on them before she hooks up with someone as naive as Piz. Is he her sweetie now? What happened to Bronson? I like Mac and Max together, but this is a sudden turn of events. I know! I was all confused. Wasn't Bronson in the 'previouslies'? And now that you all reminded me, she was talking about going to the party with Bronson, or meeting him there or something? Wasn't she? It was probably just me being all assume-y.
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 13:30:56 GMT -5
I know! I was all confused. Wasn't Bronson in the 'previouslies'? I wondered too, but now I think the earlier exchange with V about Bronson being all "up in the morning and out to hike and appreciate nature" guy was a tipoff that maybe he and Mac aren't destined to be "soulmates"--as they are too different. So she is then free to explore other relationships with more like-minded guys. A very broad category for the episode storylines: changing relationships---find the one that "fits." Mac: Bronson or Max Keith: shedding the free-spirited private eye persona and back into the straight-laced sherriff. Keith's deputies: learning how the new boss is different from the old boss. Keith and V: and her having to adjust to his new position/persona/attitudes V and L: allowing him to be with Parker V: exploring the option of Piz; exploring the option of getting over L. L: seeing how it looks from the other side when the ex moves on. Dick: 'nuff said and the whole terrorism/restaurant family thing was also about exploring and redefining relationships: male/female roles the husband and wife the dad and the daughter the dad and the Muslim suiter; the Jewish suiter the Arabs and the anti-Arab. And, as Lola points out really none of them yet tied up in a nice pretty package---lots of complexity and loose ends and "this is how real life works" not pat TV fiction. ============ Personal opinion, maybe I should keep my mouth shut, commentary: I expect there will be "fans" who protest that it's not the same as Season One but those are then same people who gripe that Buffy season 4 is not the same as seasons 1-3. It's interesting, thoughtful, well-written and fun to watch. I'm sorry for fans who only want to a show to be what they think it should be instead of allowing the creator to allow the characters to grow. Not that I dispute their right to dislike it and stop watching. All I'm saying is that I'm still in. Maybe it's not absolutely must see TV anymore, but in my book it's held up a lot better than some of the other "hot" shows that I've since dropped. Or, maybe not. To be honest if there are such people around I suggest they just stop watching, rather than watch and then whine. Why beat yourself and the show up? NOT directed at ANYBODY here and maybe these people don't even exist and I'm babbling so I supposed I should just shut up. Eh. You don't have to shut up, everyone gets to feel and think what they want, you included. Me, I've always been a "when I don't enjoy a movie, book, tv show, etc. any more, I just stop watching, reading, etc. and move on" kind of gal, and don't see why that's not an option for anyone. But back to the theme of the show . . . I wonder if we were also seeing a theme of consequences, along with complexity. Like, making fake ID's for your friends might have more consequences than you thought of at the time. Like, taking over as sherriff again might cause changes in more relationships than you thought; with your daughter, with your fellow cops, not all of whom are your old buddies from before. Like, drinking too much means you might get hurt and handing out inflammatory flyers might mean you lose the support you once had. Like, moving on to seeing another person doesn't necessarily get rid of the complicated feelings and pain you had before (and I mean this about both Veronica and Logan).
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 13:32:36 GMT -5
Smith and Jones. Of course. "You're firing us? You're the substitute teacher!" Oh dude. You really have no brains at all, do you? And then you try the "we'll all walk" thing? Never do that unless you really really know they'll all walk. 'Cuz I don't quite believe that you have as much support as you think. Ah, Veronica brings the restaurant owners to meet the kid. And it isn't magically solved. Kid isn't suddenly brought to awareness by the guy's words. He doesn't put the kid in jail either, but also sees that what Nassir did isn't illegal either. But it did "piss him off". So, he cuts off support. Which leads to the guy being grabbed by INS. Which is probably unfair, but also has the ring of truth too. And, the wife uses what he said to get him to at least meet the kid his daughter is dating. Not changing his mind yet either, but maybe there is some room to work. A bit pat in a few spots, but still reasonably true feeling. Oh, good discussion between Veronica and Keith. "It's been tough on me knowing I let you down." She sees that there are more consequences than she'd been admitting to herself. Plus, we get funny lines like "use the Mars powers for good rather than evil" and "never a stenographer around thwn you need one". But I'm thinking there's still gonna be some conflict between them over roles. Dick. What else can I say. Heh! The couch is her "emotional foxhole". ;D Awwww, a photo cake. Logan actually does seem to gravitate to girls/women who are . . . . genuinely nice. OK, that was too cliche. Getting a slice with Logan's face? Um. One of the rare mis-steps in writing.Logan and Dick are like a warped Abbot and Costello . . . "Doublemint, dude!" "They're becoming twins?" "What? I don't have time for this! . . . Do we have any peanut oil?" "Here? In the room?" And of course they were torturing you, Dick. Do you really think these schemes of yours will ever actually work? Oh, Veronica. You are soooo dumb sometimes. Yes!! Wallace tells her what the hell is going on. "What you're doing is cruel." "Be a good person. Just put him out of his misery." Oooh, and Piz steps up! "I went all in." And Veronica is . . . intrigued. So of course they're kissing when the elevator opens on Logan. Because, we must have angst! Torment! Relationship complextity at all cost! ;D On the other hand, how cute were Mac and her sweetie? Bonding over their mutual histories of not-so-legal scams. ;D Whatever do you mean by that...? **snicker** Yeah. Just a touch of anvil there, eh?
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 13:33:16 GMT -5
Whatever do you mean by that...? Could it mean: You can't have your cake and eat it too? Oooh, wicked!
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Post by Rob on May 2, 2007 19:08:39 GMT -5
How great was it to see the show back, huh? Even better, how great was it to actually see an ensemble-oriented episode? Aside from Weevil (who I always miss), it was a breath of fresh air to catch an episode that felt more like VM at its best: snappy dialogue, complex issues without movie-of-the-week endings and - most of all - no single-scene contract fulfillment cameos for Wallace, Mac, Piz, Dick, etc. Everyone is given quality scenes with actual focus on THEM, rather than simply Veronica or Logan's sounding boards. As VM eps go, I thought this installment was relatively positive; the week's mystery was not only one of their most interesting, it was also downright hopeful (!) at times. Another very important breath of fresh air was allowing Veronica to solve the mystery on her own, allowing her friends to be her FRIENDS...not pawns to be utilized whenever needed, then virtually ignored thereafter. Sure, Veronica used Piz, Wallace and Mac to shield her emotionally. But that's actually something friends really do for one another, rather than...I don't know, run interference with a convenience store clerk while Veronica steals the security footage or some such thing. There was genuine interaction, affection and emotion between Veronica, Wallace and Mac, something the show has sorely missed. As I've said before, I think Piz is a nice guy, and I'm glad Veronica is giving him a shot (assuming that will actually happen at some point). There's nothing to be gained from her continually wallowing in the emotional muck over Logan. Maybe long term V/L IS meant to be...someday. Right now, though, they need to grow up and learn their individual places in the world. I'm convinced this can only happen if they're forced to expand their horizons, independent of one another. That means seeing other people, learning how to function in a relationship. Veronica, especially, often expects more from Logan than he's capable of providing right now...and she probably can't learn that lesson until she understands that all of us have foibles and imperfections that must be dealt with. Logan, for his part, has to deal with his issues in his own way, in his own time. Veronica shouldn't be asked to shoulder his psychological burdens, and let's face facts: right now he considers her to be far more than a partner. Logan considers Veronica an emotional life-preserver, a living representative of that better part of him...the part that deserves love. He clings to her. I suppose that's a romantic notion in its way, but impossibly difficult in the long term. He still wants it both ways; his hard-partying, irresponsible side is justifiable as long as Veronica is still with him. That's both unfair and unhealthy. We can already see baby steps in the right direction: he's attending some classes, hosting co-ed social occasions that don't end in beer-soaked stupidity, interacting with Mac to the point that she has learned to like him. None of this would be happening without the breakup. Which is not to say I'm celebrating a total victory: Logan will regress somewhat. People do. Still, there are signs. I'm not sure any of that made actual sense. Bottom line: they're better apart until they're comfortable in their own skin. Ok, now to stuff I didn't like so much. Warning! Soapboxy preachy stuff ahead: 1. I understand that Keith would be concerned about Wallace and Piz's appearance at the bar, but it's unfair to paint all 19-year olds with the same brush. Obviously Keith can't just look the other way now that he's Sheriff; he has to enforce the law. I just don't get why adults who can legally vote and fight in wars are automatically less responsible than, say, a 40-year old where alcohol is concerned. Keith knows Wallace well enough to know he's a pretty responsible guy; it was grossly unfair, IMO, to equivocate him with the kid who staggered into the street and got killed merely due to their similar age. If Veronica made the ID's only for people she trusted to be responsible, I don't have that much of a problem with it. Of course, I realize that opinion will be controversial, so I move along to... 2. I'm not easily offended by any attempts at humor. Heaven knows I make all sorts of questionable jokes from time to time...but Veronica's little put-down toward the boy in the elementary school crossed the line a bit. Not that the little sexist didn't deserve a verbal smackdown; he most certainly needed to come down a peg. I was simply put off by her allusion that firefighters were uneducated functionaries. If she wanted to use classic examples like used-car salesmen or ditch-diggers, that's fine...but in real life, firefighters give their lives in order to protect us. It's one of the most honorable professions imaginable. Can you imagine if Veronica had said "the world needs Marines, too," especially with the current state of affairs? It just felt...wrong. And yeah, I probably AM overreacting. Heck, I'm probably the only one who reacted at all, so I'll leave it alone. And finally... 3. Veronica with a piece of Logan cake was a bit over the top. Overall, though....it's a welcome return to the ensemble show I grew to love. If these are truly the final days of VM, I hope they keep doing episodes like this one.
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Post by Sara on May 2, 2007 19:34:03 GMT -5
<snipped, but only for space> 2. I'm not easily offended by any attempts at humor. Heaven knows I make all sorts of questionable jokes from time to time...but Veronica's little put-down toward the boy in the elementary school crossed the line a bit. Not that the little sexist didn't deserve a verbal smackdown; he most certainly needed to come down a peg. I was simply put off by her allusion that firefighters were uneducated functionaries. If she wanted to use classic examples like used-car salesmen or ditch-diggers, that's fine...but in real life, firefighters give their lives in order to protect us. It's one of the most honorable professions imaginable. Can you imagine if Veronica had said "the world needs Marines, too," especially with the current state of affairs? It just felt...wrong. And yeah, I probably AM overreacting. Heck, I'm probably the only one who reacted at all, so I'll leave it alone. <snipped> Actually, that jibe didn't sit well with me either—I thought it was very unfair of her to categorize firemen as lacking intelligence, not to mention that the job doesn't require much in the way of brains. So no, not just you.
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Post by Lola m on May 2, 2007 20:35:33 GMT -5
How great was it to see the show back, huh? Even better, how great was it to actually see an ensemble-oriented episode? Aside from Weevil (who I always miss), it was a breath of fresh air to catch an episode that felt more like VM at its best: snappy dialogue, complex issues without movie-of-the-week endings and - most of all - no single-scene contract fulfillment cameos for Wallace, Mac, Piz, Dick, etc. Everyone is given quality scenes with actual focus on THEM, rather than simply Veronica or Logan's sounding boards. **nods** They were each actually doing things, having their own lives, etc. You know, I hadn't really thought about it, but that's a very good way to put it. No, I think you put it well. Each of them really needs to, well, build an actual life. One that they like/choose/fits them. After that, then you look for another person who will mesh with that world. But you need to be someone before you add someone. Well, I have similar opinions, so I'm sure not gonna fight you on this. But even taking that out of the picture, I think the issue itself was more than just the underage drinking thing. I think we saw Keith seeing the differences in his life being the actual "law" again. It's not just a struggle between him and Veronica. I think we're seeing some struggle within himself as well. No, I felt that too. I forgot to mention it when posting last night, but that one struck me as . . . well, just off. And not just from a standpoint of being possibly offensive. Its also felt . . . not a very good joke, not very smart. It's like . . . . OK, I'll use a Geico ad to help explain. When the therapist says that the joke wouldn't work if it was "so easy even a therapist can do it". Because she's right. Everyone would just go, um, I don't get it. And that's kinda how this one felt.
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Post by Michelle on May 3, 2007 14:52:57 GMT -5
Rob, I agree with you (and the others who ITA'd) about the fireman gibe. It wasn't really funny, and took me out of the show. As did Wallace's "friend of Dorothy" gibe at Lamb a few episodes back.
As to Keith's reaction to the Wallace's underage drinking: I hear ya, and I personally agree with you, but--Keith is a lawman now, not a P.I., and he's taking his position very seriously. Someone who defends or enforces the law can't pick and choose who should follow the law. Keith can't, in good conscience, tell his deputies to enforce the law, and then not do it himself.
I liked your comment about Veronica just hanging with her friends, not using them. I hadn't thought of that, but you're absolutely right.
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