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Post by Linda on Jul 21, 2004 5:27:24 GMT -5
Great insights, Nicki. One observation: If you look really closely at the labels on the canned food, you'll see they all come from "Blue Sun Company." That's very significant, as they are a huge corporation who apparently sponsored the academy that River attended. So the "hands of blue" men are from Blue Sun; hence River's tirade as she rips off the labels of their products. Hi Erin! Eetah about Nicki's insights. Umm, slight disagreement about the label peeling, though. I watched the episode twice last night (the second time to hear Jane E's commentary) and I thought that the cans from which River peeled the labels were the cans without the Blue Sun marking (i.e. no Blue stamp on the flat ends). I think this actually is in keeping with Nicki's theme of appearances being deceiving. Book apparently makes a significant remark about not knowing what was inside the cans because the labels were missing. Jane E. mentioned that she wished that Book's line was made more audible. So the "mystery meals" line was significant. But I think the mystery is actually the people of Serenity, who defy social labels, rather than the Blue Sun-ners. And I think River's tirade still fits, if we think of her as hiding identities from Blue Sun by peeling off the labels. But of course it's possible that I missed the Blue Sun symbol on the cans if they weren't actually blue. (Geekily did a slo-mo pass in order to check my facts, but I admit to imperfect eyesight.) Linda, only two eyes, but farsighted, nearsighted and astigmatism.
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Post by Linda on Jul 21, 2004 6:05:16 GMT -5
The trouble is that Inara's always shown herself to have high standards for who she'll take as a customer, and has more than once specified that she tries, at least, to only have customers she actually likes. I could see Atherton pulling off the charade once or twice, but as a regular - if he's this much of a creep, I would have hoped she'd tire of him and not want to spend any more time around him than necessary. Hi Rachael! I really enjoy reading your post-episode posts. Assume the Eetah. Regarding Inara's choice of Atherton: I think that it is possible that this was the first time she was out with him in such a wide social setting. If Serenity's stays on Persephone were all relatively short, they may have spent all of their time in the bedroom. You know, stamina and all. (So sorry about the scary mental picture ) If their former interactions were mostly physical, then it is conceivable that he would have behaved much more attentively. I can't help but wonder how much insult she is willing to take from a client. Or how much she lets the unspoken slights lie. Her statement to Mal about his forcing Atherton to utter the insult seems to me that she was aware at some level of his true opinion. For me, the most useful way of thinking about Inara's profession is by equating her with a Geisha. Joss deliberately made that connection when Inara performed a tea ceremony for the first client we ever saw in Serenity (who also insulted her, by the way). The world of the Geisha is steeped in ritual and tradition. And to me (not an expert by any means, having gotten most of my info from Arthur Golden's Memoirs of a Geisha), it is a weird combination of status & stigma. The true power and status of a Geisha's house lies in the ability to allow or refuse a supplicant's entry. And so the power depends upon the very shaky foundation of the perceived desirability of said entry. Beauty, training & grace are all very well, but too many refusals and the desirability, and therefore status, of a house or guild may eventually erode. I can imagine that no one is blacklisted unless there is sufficient reason. Because there will always be those who stigmatize the profession, and bitter rejects would be the most vociferous. There was so much about Inara and the guild that could have been explored. (Stupid network suits.) Linda, April 2005, April 2005, April 2005...
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Post by Linda on Jul 21, 2004 6:12:05 GMT -5
Hi All! Great posts so far! This was one of my favorite episodes. But then, I'm a fan of Jane Espenson and Jane Austen. In the episode commentary, Jane E. mentions that she is a fan of Jane Austen, too. Jane Austen's novels are the arch-typical Romantic Comedies of Manners. But under the romance, comedy and manners is a serious, if satirical, consideration of social status (and rituals), honorable (moral) behavior and pretention (deception). So that was how I watched the episode this time around. Romance: Mal and Inara demonstrated their love for each other in every way except actually saying the words "I love you." Mal asked Inara not to take Ath's offer for no good reason except that he was asking her not to. Inara offered to sacrifice her happiness by accepting Ath's offer in order to save Mal's life. And despite their mutual insults, Inara and Mal visibly enjoy and relax in each other's company. Comedy: Well, I don't think the phrases "corpsified and gross" & "Captain Tight-pants" & "Well, I'm all right" can be said too often. And I loved the offended look on Mal's face when Jayne provided Badger with the descriptive word "pretentious". And everyone has already pointed out many other fine examples. Manners: Inara points out that Mal breaks the rules of whatever Society he's in. So very true. A rude, good man. Social Status: Lola's catch about the "sad little king of a sad little hill" applying to both Badger and Atherton made me think about how the social rituals of both Mal's & Inara's respective worlds were on display. Badger invited Mal to his little beverages-that-make-you-go-blind party and Atherton invited Inara to the big Shindig. Both Mal and Inara demonstrated that they had more social clout than the invitors: Mal by making the deal with Sir Sash and Inara by blacklisting Ath. Neither Mal nor Inara particularly enjoyed the social rituals except when they were with each other. Oh, and slavery was brought up at least twice: the bar fight and Kaylee's bitca. We already found out in Serenity that Badger deals in slaves. Now we know that the people of Atherton's world do too. Makes Serenity seem like even more of a haven. Although I wonder what it means that two old white guys lent their social status to Kaylee and to Mal to help them trump their enemies. Honorable behavior: Mal, despite his lack of manners and his life of crime, is an honorable guy. He doesn't approve of slavery, defended Inara and stood his ground. He also makes the distinction between Inara and her profession. Ath, on the other hand, treated Inara like a possession and had no problem challenging someone with inferior skills to a duel, with the intent of killing him. Pretention: See Nicki's "Appearances can be deceiving" post. The actual word was used at least twice: once as Jayne's & Badger's description of Mal and once as Inara making a comment during the Ball. Lots of other stuff in this episode, but it's late again. Linda, 3 am? Night all!
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Post by Lola m on Jul 21, 2004 14:45:17 GMT -5
Hi Rachael! I really enjoy reading your post-episode posts. Assume the Eetah. Regarding Inara's choice of Atherton: I think that it is possible that this was the first time she was out with him in such a wide social setting. If Serenity's stays on Persephone were all relatively short, they may have spent all of their time in the bedroom. You know, stamina and all. (So sorry about the scary mental picture ) If their former interactions were mostly physical, then it is conceivable that he would have behaved much more attentively. I can't help but wonder how much insult she is willing to take from a client. Or how much she lets the unspoken slights lie. Her statement to Mal about his forcing Atherton to utter the insult seems to me that she was aware at some level of his true opinion. For me, the most useful way of thinking about Inara's profession is by equating her with a Geisha. Joss deliberately made that connection when Inara performed a tea ceremony for the first client we ever saw in Serenity (who also insulted her, by the way). The world of the Geisha is steeped in ritual and tradition. And to me (not an expert by any means, having gotten most of my info from Arthur Golden's Memoirs of a Geisha), it is a weird combination of status & stigma. The true power and status of a Geisha's house lies in the ability to allow or refuse a supplicant's entry. And so the power depends upon the very shaky foundation of the perceived desirability of said entry. Beauty, training & grace are all very well, but too many refusals and the desirability, and therefore status, of a house or guild may eventually erode. I can imagine that no one is blacklisted unless there is sufficient reason. Because there will always be those who stigmatize the profession, and bitter rejects would be the most vociferous. There was so much about Inara and the guild that could have been explored. (Stupid network suits.) Linda, April 2005, April 2005, April 2005... Eetah, eetah! I like the Geisha analogy a lot. Seems like that could make for a pretty fair comparison to the role of a companion. I like that because it places as much emphasis on other skills, beyond just straightforward sex. A geisha's main, stated, primary purpose is to entertain - to play an instrument or sing, usually, but also primarily as an entertaining companion at a party. A mark of status to impress your guests - to honor them and to show your own importance. A geisha's work would include being a gracious guest, smoothing things over, keeping the fun going, seeing that the food and drink goes around and making sure all have a pleasant evening. Sex is just one component and is not the "public" face of the geisha. Huh. Purchasable entertainment, status symbol, and sex. This seemed very much the kind of service that Inara was providing for Atherton. Lola
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Post by Queen E on Jul 28, 2004 9:08:15 GMT -5
Sara:
Excellent job on the review...pointing out the many inversions and turn abouts in this episode.
Don't have a whole lot to add to your work and the comments here, except to say that referring to Banning and Co as "Heathers" so captures it! So much at the Shindig could be perceived as "useless." The chandelier, which was pretty and expensive but Mal couldn't see the point of it. The superfluous Miss Persephone sash Harrow wore. Atherton constantly engaging in duels for lack of anything valuable to do (I'm assuming).
But you left out one of my favorite lines:
BADGER I know a place he'll be. Safe place. Using some new-tech gun scans. High-class too. Wouldn't let me in there. You might slip in. Course you couldn't buy an invite with a diamond the size of a testicle, but I got my hands on a couple.
Mal and Jayne glance at each other, snickering like little boys.
BADGER Of invites! You want this meeting or not?
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Post by Lola m on Jul 30, 2004 12:50:04 GMT -5
Sara - excellent, excellent review!
Loved your comparison of Inara to a courtesan. I also liked Linda's thoughts about a geisha comparison. And you put your finger on something very interesting to watch more in future eps. As you said:
There have been many examples of this kind of influencial, sophisticated female prostitution in history and they generally have all taken place in societies where other women do not have their level of freedom and power. Now we've seen women have a very equal role in the frontier societies that Serenity visits. So is this a glimpse at a very different structure in the central planets? Very intriging to think about. Thanks so much for pointing this out.
Also loved how you depicted the push and pull of the Mal & Inara relationship. is a particularly insightful observation.
I love the contrast between them and Zoe and Wash.
Thanks again, Sara!
Lola
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Post by Linda on Aug 30, 2004 5:06:05 GMT -5
Hi Sara! Excellent review. Eetah, eetah, eetah! I figured this would be a bit more succinct than quoting your whole review. Thank you for your insights into Mal and Inara. I especially liked: Mal is understandably closed off. Why is Inara? Stupid Network Suits. www.soulfulspike.com/membersavatars/smileys/badrazz.gif[/img]And if I may look forward a few episodes: I was wondering what Joss was trying to say when, in Out of Gas, Mal never reached the red button. Your review made me think that perhaps the lesson is: sometimes you can't do it alone -- sometimes you *need* someone to help you (by disobeying your direct orders). Thank you again for the excellent review. Linda, two eps this weekend so far -- yay!
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Post by Pixi on Jun 22, 2005 9:55:33 GMT -5
The key seems to be giving Jayne a heavy stick and standing back. Uh huh. Sounds good to me. ;D Another great bar brawl to add to the collection. Love to see how . . . happy. . . Mal is in a fight. Mal is happy and fightin' all fancy - pulling a coat over someone's head and so on. Jayne, on the other hand, doesn't seem happy or not happy, just . . . efficient. Atherton appears such the charmer in his first, long-distance appearance on Inara's screen. But we start to get a taste of his true icky-ness even before Mal gets in the fight with him. As he and Inara are working the room, she is just so much . . . better at it than him. So gracious and, well, professional. And he starts with the cracks. Like saying "Oh, she blushes. Not many in your line of work do that". Something tells me the real nobility, the "truly classy" as it were, would never be so crass as to mention that she is there in a professional capacity. Love the little details, like Mal knowing Atherton is a regular. So Mal keeps up to date on Inara's clients, huh? Love the Badger scenes too. First back at his "lair" with the tea cups full of wood-alcohol. And there's Jayne in the background of the whole scene, daintily picking up sugar cubes to drop in his liquor and grabbing handfuls of little sandwiches with the crusts cut off. Too precious for words! But River taking him out with her lovely little speech is the best. Like "Spent some time in lock down. But less than you claim." Oooo, zing. Little flinch there. And then - Badger: "Nice to see someone from the old homestead." River: (oh so deadpan delivery) "Not really." Ouch! Best. Insult. Evah! River's summary line about Badger, "Sad little king of a sad little hill" - I've always thought it was meant to be a summary of Atherton, too. That parting scene with him trying to threaten Inara and she just shoves some real perspective right down his throat. He's a sad little minor noble on a sad little outer rim world. And she's a highly respected companion from rich central planets like Sihnon or Osiris, and with all the power of her guild behind her. Lola I agree. That is a perfect summation of Atherton. You know- the minute I saw this actor (whose name I don't know) I knew he was slimy. He always plays weasals. So I kept waiting for the shoe to drop.
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Post by Pixi on Jun 22, 2005 9:58:52 GMT -5
Appearances Can Be Deceiving Nothing is as it appears on the surface. We hear the word pretentious from Jayne and Inara. Pretentious can mean making an unjustified claim. What claims are unjustified in Shindig? The pool game isn't even real. What is the possible reason for a holographic pool game? It's not like pool balls are an endangered species. When Mal takes the money, Inara looks shocked, but she puts it away. Inara seems like a sheltered lady, but she's a practical woman. Zoe says Persephone 'feels like home'. Mal says it's 'not home.' Zoe seems to want a home, but Mal knows they won't find in there. Inara's interchange with Atheron Wing is full of the sort of untruths we hear every day. 'It's wonderful to see you' my 'heart is in my throat.' Inara is very carefully choosing her next client and her words. Kaylee wants the "pretties." More about her later, she's the only one who doesn't make some sort of pretense. Mal wants to leave when the women are talking about Inara's clothes. His excuse is that the bag he's carrying isn't 'feathers.' The women mention Inara needing clothes 'like that', but the clothes are another unjustified claim. Inara would still be a beautiful, intelligent woman even if she wore a burlap bag. Mal knows he hurt Kaylee's feelings when he unjustifiably said that her wearing a pretty dress would 'be like a sheep on two legs'--definitely an unjustified claim. Zoe wants to say more to the captain, but she just easily lifts the bag--disproving that it's heavy--and walks away. Zoe calls Mal captain, but it's obvious she doesn't really feel he deserves that designation right now. The girls at the party certainly make an unjustified claim to be ladies. They're the worst kind of rude. Atherton tells Inara that he 'admires her more and more', but it's obvious he only admires the reflected glow she give him. Inara tells Mal that Atherton 'likes me whether you see it, or not.' Oh, Inara, you know better. Atherton doesn't really like anyone but himself and he never will. I loved the exchange with Kaylee and the guys at the party, but even here we see some pretensions. About the 8010 engine, Kaylee says 'they changed the plate and hoped no one noticed.' Poor River even seems to think the canned food is making unjustified claims on the labels. She tells Badger that he's made greater claims to 'lockdown' time than is real. Inara tries to tell Mal that a lot of fencing is feinting--fooling the other person into believing you're going to make one move, but actually making another. She even tries to warn him 'don't fall for that', but Mal charges ahead and can't or won't listen. Back to Kaylee. She is the only one who takes things at face value. She sees the prettiness of the pink ruffles, not the lack of stylishness. She hears the compliment, not the cattiness behind it. Kaylee is innocent, her motives are pure. Her delight in the gown, the party, the food and the people is real. Even after the other girls were rude, she still says it was a 'real nice party.' Most of us would have seen the pretentiousness of the people at the people, but Kaylee sees the good and ignores the bad. That's why she'll never see Serenity as junk. She loves Serenity and she only sees the good. Oooooh! Nice catch on a theme, there Nicki! Brava! Kaylee is also the only one of the crew who just assumed that Mal was going to win the duel and come back to the ship. When Zoe says "It doesn't hurt to have a contingency plan", the look on her face just shows you she never eve thought things might not happen just as he said. "He said not to do anything. He'll join us after he wins the duel." And let's not forget the card game that Book and Jayne and Simon are playing. Card games are a great way to learn about each other and also to hide from each other. Book seems very good at gambling for a shepherd; Simon is surprisingly good at presenting a blank facade during play and Jayne is actually the most straightforward - in that I was expecting that he'd cheat and I was right. Lola I love the fact that Jayne cheats. Love it. Little character details that are just thrown away are what make this universe so real. I feel that here - more than the Buffy/Angel verses - Joss just gets every little thing right. This show is indeed (as Vlad so movingly posted) a culmination of his creativity. An adult show, with adult themes. Boy I started this morning worshiping Rob Thomas (so much bowing and kissing of the computer monitor takes a lot out of you) now I'm feeling a strong urge to go do some Joss worshiping. I kind of wish I could grab all those Season 7 disullisioned Buffy watchers - who felt Joss had lost it - and have them sit down and watch all the Firefly discs as I did. Their faith would be renewed.
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Post by Pixi on Jun 22, 2005 10:00:37 GMT -5
Appearances Can Be Deceiving Nothing is as it appears on the surface. We hear the word pretentious from Jayne and Inara. Pretentious can mean making an unjustified claim. What claims are unjustified in Shindig? The pool game isn't even real. What is the possible reason for a holographic pool game? It's not like pool balls are an endangered species. When Mal takes the money, Inara looks shocked, but she puts it away. Inara seems like a sheltered lady, but she's a practical woman. Zoe says Persephone 'feels like home'. Mal says it's 'not home.' Zoe seems to want a home, but Mal knows he won't find it there and since he keeps making enemies, he won't find a home anywhere else, either. Inara's interchange with Atheron Wing is full of the sort of untruths we hear every day. 'It's wonderful to see you' my 'heart is in my throat.' Inara is very carefully choosing her next client and her words. Kaylee wants the "pretties." More about her later, she's the only one who doesn't make some sort of pretense. Mal wants to leave when the women are talking about Inara's clothes. His excuse is that the bag he's carrying isn't 'feathers.' The women mention Inara needing clothes 'like that', but the clothes are another unjustified claim. Inara would still be a beautiful, intelligent woman even if she wore a burlap bag. Mal knows he hurt Kaylee's feelings when he unjustifiably said that her wearing a pretty dress would 'be like a sheep on two legs'--definitely an unjustified claim. Zoe wants to say more to the captain, but she just easily lifts the bag--disproving that it's heavy--and walks away. Zoe calls Mal captain, but it's obvious she doesn't really feel he deserves that designation right now. The girls at the party certainly make an unjustified claim to be ladies. They're the worst kind of rude. Atherton tells Inara that he 'admires her more and more', but it's obvious he only admires the reflected glow she give him. Inara tells Mal that Atherton 'likes me whether you see it, or not.' Oh, Inara, you know better. Atherton doesn't really like anyone but himself and he never will. I loved the exchange with Kaylee and the guys at the party, but even here we see some pretensions. About the 8010 engine, Kaylee says 'they changed the plate and hoped no one noticed.' Poor River even seems to think the canned food is making unjustified claims on the labels. She tells Badger that he's made greater claims to 'lockdown' time than is real. Inara tries to tell Mal that a lot of fencing is feinting--fooling the other person into believing you're going to make one move, but actually making another. She even tries to warn him 'don't fall for that', but Mal charges ahead and can't or won't listen. Back to Kaylee. She is the only one who takes things at face value. She sees the prettiness of the pink ruffles, not the lack of stylishness. She hears the compliment, not the cattiness behind it. Kaylee is innocent, her motives are pure. Her delight in the gown, the party, the food and the people is real. Even after the other girls were rude, she still says it was a 'real nice party.' Most of us would have seen the pretentiousness of the people at the people, but Kaylee sees the good and ignores the bad. That's why she'll never see Serenity as junk. She loves Serenity and she only sees the good. Great insights, Nicki. One observation: If you look really closely at the labels on the canned food, you'll see they all come from "Blue Sun Company." That's very significant, as they are a huge corporation who apparently sponsored the academy that River attended. So the "hands of blue" men are from Blue Sun; hence River's tirade as she rips off the labels of their products. Erin - I did not catch that at all. Neat, just neat! I love that. And I must say I did wonder why she suddenly went all ranty on the food. Duh! Bravo on being observant.
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Post by Pixi on Jun 22, 2005 10:15:48 GMT -5
The trouble is that Inara's always shown herself to have high standards for who she'll take as a customer, and has more than once specified that she tries, at least, to only have customers she actually likes. I could see Atherton pulling off the charade once or twice, but as a regular - if he's this much of a creep, I would have hoped she'd tire of him and not want to spend any more time around him than necessary. Hi Rachael! I really enjoy reading your post-episode posts. Assume the Eetah. Regarding Inara's choice of Atherton: I think that it is possible that this was the first time she was out with him in such a wide social setting. If Serenity's stays on Persephone were all relatively short, they may have spent all of their time in the bedroom. You know, stamina and all. (So sorry about the scary mental picture ) If their former interactions were mostly physical, then it is conceivable that he would have behaved much more attentively. I can't help but wonder how much insult she is willing to take from a client. Or how much she lets the unspoken slights lie. Her statement to Mal about his forcing Atherton to utter the insult seems to me that she was aware at some level of his true opinion. For me, the most useful way of thinking about Inara's profession is by equating her with a Geisha. Joss deliberately made that connection when Inara performed a tea ceremony for the first client we ever saw in Serenity (who also insulted her, by the way). The world of the Geisha is steeped in ritual and tradition. And to me (not an expert by any means, having gotten most of my info from Arthur Golden's Memoirs of a Geisha), it is a weird combination of status & stigma. The true power and status of a Geisha's house lies in the ability to allow or refuse a supplicant's entry. And so the power depends upon the very shaky foundation of the perceived desirability of said entry. Beauty, training & grace are all very well, but too many refusals and the desirability, and therefore status, of a house or guild may eventually erode. I can imagine that no one is blacklisted unless there is sufficient reason. Because there will always be those who stigmatize the profession, and bitter rejects would be the most vociferous. There was so much about Inara and the guild that could have been explored. (Stupid network suits.) Linda, April 2005, April 2005, April 2005... Ahh - I like the Geisha connection. Is Geisha Japanese? I read somewhere that the actress cast in the upcoming Geisha movie is Chinese and had to learn about Japanese culture for it. But it still fits in with the whole Oriental theme(the mandarin spoken, the clothes, etc) to have hookers/companions suddenly be respected and well-known. I guess I come down on the you have to pick one of these guys if you want to make some money, practical aspect of Inara's work. It would seem to me that if you actually practice this profession, you have to pretty much ignore insults, slights, etc. as long as it doesn't become overt and demeaning. It must be part of the training. Or how else would she ever pick a client?
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Post by Pixi on Jun 22, 2005 10:50:13 GMT -5
This truly was a fun episode. And I liked Sir Sash (Hee - nice name Linda).
Zoe: Planet's coming up a mite fast. Wash: That's just cause, I'm going down too quick. Likely crash and kill us all. Mal: Well, that happens, let me know.
Wash, Wash, Wash - you are so bad!
Things I liked:
Kaylee's ruffly dress, her lusting after the buffet and the old dude who came and put down the Cordettes that were picking on her. Kaylee is just played perfectly. Just when you think she's all sugar and sweetness - you get her all feisty.
I wonder who would fix the engine faster in a crisis - Scotty or Kaylee. Course wouldn't want Kaylee around Captian Kirk.
Zoe continues her theme of threatening to hurt Jayne. Hee! I just love the way her character is portrayed. Of all the slayers and super-powered beings that have sauntered through Joss' universes - Zoe is both powerful, comfortable with her power, comfortable in her service, comfortable in her lovelife.
I just love Zoe.
The infamous Captain Tightpants line!
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Post by Lola m on Jun 22, 2005 21:51:03 GMT -5
Oooooh! Nice catch on a theme, there Nicki! Brava! Kaylee is also the only one of the crew who just assumed that Mal was going to win the duel and come back to the ship. When Zoe says "It doesn't hurt to have a contingency plan", the look on her face just shows you she never eve thought things might not happen just as he said. "He said not to do anything. He'll join us after he wins the duel." And let's not forget the card game that Book and Jayne and Simon are playing. Card games are a great way to learn about each other and also to hide from each other. Book seems very good at gambling for a shepherd; Simon is surprisingly good at presenting a blank facade during play and Jayne is actually the most straightforward - in that I was expecting that he'd cheat and I was right. Lola I love the fact that Jayne cheats. Love it. Little character details that are just thrown away are what make this universe so real. I feel that here - more than the Buffy/Angel verses - Joss just gets every little thing right. This show is indeed (as Vlad so movingly posted) a culmination of his creativity. An adult show, with adult themes. Boy I started this morning worshiping Rob Thomas (so much bowing and kissing of the computer monitor takes a lot out of you) now I'm feeling a strong urge to go do some Joss worshiping. I kind of wish I could grab all those Season 7 disullisioned Buffy watchers - who felt Joss had lost it - and have them sit down and watch all the Firefly discs as I did. Their faith would be renewed. I tell ya, the few Buffy fans I know that I've convinced to watch Firefly the right way (right order, all the eps, etc.) have all been stunned by how good it is. As you say, he got all the details right.
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