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Post by Karen on Nov 5, 2006 20:23:03 GMT -5
Overall, Barrowman is doing a good job at playing an American, but when he said eeestrogen rather than ehstrogen, it was a dead give-away. ;D He lived in the USA since he was 8 until after college, and then again other times. Huh. His dad worked at Caterpillar in Aurora, just north of me about 45 minutes. At the same plant that my stbx works at. I bet he's talked to him (the dad) a time or two. That's only, what, 4 degress of separation? ;D
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Post by Queen E on Nov 11, 2006 7:15:45 GMT -5
Hee! It makes me want to write a whole paper on it. (That's how i express my admiration these days.) And really? That's awesome and flattering; I love Gwen. I really like how she follows her instincts in this episode; she knows something is off, even through her amnesia. I'm wondering, too, if Jack told her about the amnesia pill as a sort of test. He knew, he had to know what she would do, because Yanto accesses her computer and turns it off. And yet she still has the sense to write "Remember" on the brochure for the bill wall thing with the Welsh writing on it... I'd read that paper. It's true. Gwen really does remind me of you. I love her. Smart, tenacious, sassy and blessed with courage. Perfect for the team. And, I think, grounded in a way that they need. She doesn't seem to be the type to let the whole power of alien technologies seduce her easily. Jack was hoping, I think, that she would do exactly as she did and find them. The memory pill thing could have been a test, because you're right, he knew exactly what she would do. Why not handwrite it down, I wonder? She did with the "remember" so it all worked. I guess if she could break the amnesia she was a good recruit? I wonder, for how long did Jack know about or suspect Sue's relationship to the murders? And I'm still blushing; if I possess half those qualities, I'd consider myself lucky! (I should get started on that paper...) Having watched it again, I'm almost certain it's a test. There was no reason to tell her. He could have just done it and been done with it. She'd wake up the next day with nothing to remember. As for the "handwritten" part, one could say it was just "convenient" so that it could be hacked and erased, but the funny thing is that I totally buy that she would do that. Most people do go straight to the computer to write things...there is a pervasive attitude that somehow, putting it on a hard drive is safer than paper, which can be crumpled, burned, or tossed. (Of course, I'm the freak who writes everything, including novels, in longhand first. ) And it's the "handwritten" part that saves the day, so to speak. So #badrazz# to computers! *grin* I agree, too, that Jack sees Gwen as someone who has much more of a connection with the world than any of them, especially Jack himself, has. How could he? The 51st century to the 1940s to Platform 1 to 2006. As for the rest of the crew, so much of their time is spent "below" every day life, even if all of them are actually of this time (do we really know that?). They interact meaningfully (from what I've seen) only with each other, which is very very dangerous. Gwen, however, is daily "on the streets," seeing the ordinary, the best, and the worst of humanity. She is the only one who has a relationship outside Torchwood (which is in danger, it seems, but that's for another post)... What Jack knew before Sue and Gwen's confrontation, I don't know, but I think he might have had his suspicions. He is very good at reading people, and Sue's avidity at the opening crime scene might have sparked questions in him...
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Post by Onjel on Nov 13, 2006 8:14:02 GMT -5
I'd read that paper. It's true. Gwen really does remind me of you. I love her. Smart, tenacious, sassy and blessed with courage. Perfect for the team. And, I think, grounded in a way that they need. She doesn't seem to be the type to let the whole power of alien technologies seduce her easily. Jack was hoping, I think, that she would do exactly as she did and find them. The memory pill thing could have been a test, because you're right, he knew exactly what she would do. Why not handwrite it down, I wonder? She did with the "remember" so it all worked. I guess if she could break the amnesia she was a good recruit? I wonder, for how long did Jack know about or suspect Sue's relationship to the murders? And I'm still blushing; if I possess half those qualities, I'd consider myself lucky! (I should get started on that paper...) Having watched it again, I'm almost certain it's a test. There was no reason to tell her. He could have just done it and been done with it. She'd wake up the next day with nothing to remember. As for the "handwritten" part, one could say it was just "convenient" so that it could be hacked and erased, but the funny thing is that I totally buy that she would do that. Most people do go straight to the computer to write things...there is a pervasive attitude that somehow, putting it on a hard drive is safer than paper, which can be crumpled, burned, or tossed. (Of course, I'm the freak who writes everything, including novels, in longhand first. ) And it's the "handwritten" part that saves the day, so to speak. So to computers! *grin* I agree, too, that Jack sees Gwen as someone who has much more of a connection with the world than any of them, especially Jack himself, has. How could he? The 51st century to the 1940s to Platform 1 to 2006. As for the rest of the crew, so much of their time is spent "below" every day life, even if all of them are actually of this time (do we really know that?). They interact meaningfully (from what I've seen) only with each other, which is very very dangerous. Gwen, however, is daily "on the streets," seeing the ordinary, the best, and the worst of humanity. She is the only one who has a relationship outside Torchwood (which is in danger, it seems, but that's for another post)... What Jack knew before Sue and Gwen's confrontation, I don't know, but I think he might have had his suspicions. He is very good at reading people, and Sue's avidity at the opening crime scene might have sparked questions in him... I have a feeling you're right, that he had some suspicions before the confrontation. It may have been why he was looking to add Gwen. He knew Sue would be gone and needed the additional person. So, definitely the memory pill announcement was a test. And, Gwen passed! For which I am grateful.
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Post by Matthew on Nov 13, 2006 12:00:37 GMT -5
Yep. Dark. Noir. And with the rain. Jack being able to taste the estrogen in it, telling us right off that he is not the biggest fan of humans with his sarcastic -"Love this planet ". Not like Dr. Who, who seems to be a bit of a fan. Overall, Barrowman is doing a good job at playing an American, but when he said eeestrogen rather than ehstrogen, it was a dead give-away. ;D Well, we don't have any real CLEAR evidence that Captain Jack is actually an American: JACK is playing one. And I get the feeling that him saying "EEstrogen" was more to avoid a zillion phone calls into the Beeb saying "Captain Jack doesn't know how to say "Estrogen" correctly!"
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Post by Onjel on Nov 13, 2006 20:06:44 GMT -5
Overall, Barrowman is doing a good job at playing an American, but when he said eeestrogen rather than ehstrogen, it was a dead give-away. ;D Well, we don't have any real CLEAR evidence that Captain Jack is actually an American: JACK is playing one. And I get the feeling that him saying "EEstrogen" was more to avoid a zillion phone calls into the Beeb saying "Captain Jack doesn't know how to say "Estrogen" correctly!" If he's the same guy from WWII, then he would be American, IIRC. But, you could be right about the eestrogen thing.
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Post by Matthew on Nov 14, 2006 0:21:46 GMT -5
Well, we don't have any real CLEAR evidence that Captain Jack is actually an American: JACK is playing one. And I get the feeling that him saying "EEstrogen" was more to avoid a zillion phone calls into the Beeb saying "Captain Jack doesn't know how to say "Estrogen" correctly!" If he's the same guy from WWII, then he would be American, IIRC. But, you could be right about the eestrogen thing. Jack was PLAYING an American pilot in WWII. Nine commented to Rose that he was the "man of the future" up to and including his widespread and casual "dancing" preferences.
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Post by Onjel on Nov 14, 2006 9:09:39 GMT -5
If he's the same guy from WWII, then he would be American, IIRC. But, you could be right about the eestrogen thing. Jack was PLAYING an American pilot in WWII. Nine commented to Rose that he was the "man of the future" up to and including his widespread and casual "dancing" preferences. I think I'm going to have to re-watch those Who eps. But, in the pilot here, wasn't there evidence that an American by the name of Jack Harkness was alive during WWII? Isn't that what they found when looking for him?
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Post by Matthew on Nov 14, 2006 12:12:25 GMT -5
Jack was PLAYING an American pilot in WWII. Nine commented to Rose that he was the "man of the future" up to and including his widespread and casual "dancing" preferences. I think I'm going to have to re-watch those Who eps. But, in the pilot here, wasn't there evidence that an American by the name of Jack Harkness was alive during WWII? Isn't that what they found when looking for him? Yeah, as an American pilot flying for the Brits during the Battle of Britain! Who suddenly dissapeared one day.....
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Jun 17, 2007 10:08:07 GMT -5
That's an interesting way of of pronouncing estrogen.
contraceptives in the rain.
John Tucker.
CSI: Cardiff. Hee.
It's an alien! Or a mutated human.
A man in a big gray coat. Vague enough?
Captain Jack's backstory.
Gwen.
Oooh, secret passageways. Cool.
A hand in a jar.
The Bat Cave.
They were playing her.
Circular questions.
Introducing the gang.
It's way beyond classified.
So Gwen's going to become their contact at the police?
Ah, so that's how they disappeared into thin air.
Know how to use it, but not how it happened.
That is so Welsh. Hee. I think.
"You people."
Doctor Who whackiness. And the official explanation.
Torchwood mission is to capture aliens.
They're not affiliated with anyone.
No one takes anything outside. Except for everyone.
More than one unit.
Torchwood 1 London, destroyed.
Torchwood 2 Glasgow.
Torchwood 3 Cardiff.
Torchwood 4 is missing.
Testing the glove, not investigating the murder.
Touch of denial, dash of retcon. Hee!
So why did Captain Jack tell her the truth when he was just going to give her the amnesia pill? Other than for exposition purposes, I mean.
Threesome!?
Ah, but Torchwood didn't account for anyone else that she talked to.
So she did it. Just to test to glove.
Captain Jack hears it all.
And he can't be killed.
She's remarkably well preserved for having shot herself in the face.
So Gwen joins up.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Jun 17, 2007 10:09:12 GMT -5
Thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat mooooooooooooved veeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrry sloooooooowwwwwwwwly.
Especially for a pilot, which usually has a lot of information to jam in.
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Post by Michelle on Sept 9, 2007 11:12:44 GMT -5
I LOVE LOVE LOVED this but kind of random, not in any particular order of importance, thoughts: .... I don't think it's all that dark. I don't know why, it just doesn't feel bleak and hopless or...whatever. There are a lot of things to look forward to, IMO, and the characters seem to present that. Jack is quite taken with Gwen. Perhaps for the same reason I am: she's intensely curious, intelligent, gutsy and connected. And Gwen herself is the antithesis of dark, gloomy, etc. She's thoughtful. Thoughtful is different from dark and doesn't necessarily lead to it. We have all the Jack backstory to look forward to. Gwen will start digging for it, this we know. I agree, not exceedingly dark. I do see Jack as scarily amoral however, but imagine someone who can't be killed would be that way. Again, I agree about the relative non-shock about the kissing. I had never heard that story about Joss though! That is interesting. I had no idea he had such a struggle with the network over that. The Season 7 Willow/Kennedy scene shows how much things had changed in two years. And being that it was a different network, I'm guessing Joss made sure that W/K scene was in there to thumb his nose at the WB. I was shocked when Jack took a bullet to the head and immediately recovered, but Susie telegraphed her suicide, so that just seemed like a convenient writing ploy to get rid of the Bad Guy. Good episode! I hope the quality prevails in ensuing eps.
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Post by Onjel on Sept 9, 2007 14:00:21 GMT -5
I watched this again late last night. My first viewing was on my computer. What a difference a larger screen makes. I was absolutely on the edge of my seat when Gwen was walking toward the Weevil. Even knowing that she wouldn't be killed by it. I love how Jack was nattering on about the rain while the crew was working with the stabbing victim. It was just as good, if not better, this time around. The more I watch Who and TW the more invested in the stories and the characters I become.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Sept 9, 2007 15:33:27 GMT -5
I'm rewatching mostly curious to see what, if anything is cut out.
The interrogation of the corpse scene is a lot more interesting this time round.
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Post by Rachael on Sept 10, 2007 13:26:50 GMT -5
So, couple of things - one, it was really really good. Especially for a pilot. However - The Glove-of-not-Mynagon may well have been lifted from "The Pickup Artist" by Terry Bisson. The whole bit about bringing back the recently deceased and talking to them, plus the whole bit about being panicked and disbelieving that you're dead. (Of course, that particular emotional response is pretty much the one that's to be expected upon finding out you've just died..) Jack would say "Estrogens", NOT "EEstrogens". Him being American, and all. Funny thing is, John Barrowman is semi-American, and yet. ETA: Yup, I knew others would catch the "eestrogen" thing.
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Post by Rachael on Sept 10, 2007 13:54:12 GMT -5
Well, I can't begin to compare with all the deep philosophical talk (though reading it was great).
I concur with Shan that I don't think it's (so far) all that dark. More adult, sure, but so far it's just not silly the way DW often is. (In a good way; I love the silly.)
And I agree that the reason that Jack possibly cares so much what the dead guy saw is because either he's seen something and wants to find out if it's just him, or a universal something...or because now that he can't die, he desperately wants to know what comes next for everyone else.
I find it fascinating that TARDIS!Rose made Jack into a semi-Timelord. And I'm dying to know if she did it on purpose, or it's just a side-effect of having been brought back by the energy of the Time Vortex. It's sort of regeneration...does it work that way on everyone?
What's gonna happen to Rose when she dies?
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