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Post by beccaelizabeth on Dec 25, 2006 0:15:08 GMT -5
If I could bring myself to care about Owen or Gwen, this would be a good episode. Well written, just... I've had enough of the falling apart thing. could they maybe fall together a bit? ETA: episode comments
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Post by Matthew on Dec 27, 2006 23:05:49 GMT -5
If I could bring myself to care about Owen or Gwen, this would be a good episode. Well written, just... I've had enough of the falling apart thing. could they maybe fall together a bit? I care about Gwen a bit, and it's a nice bit of symmetry that she's joined the team in self-destructive self-justified idiotic behavior so quickly. Scary that Jack, the unkillable tortured immortal, is the most "together" mentally of all of them, doing this job. I think Torchwood 3 needs a bit larger staff. Owen? Owen was trying to die, I thought. I don't see how Jack can rely on him for anything now. Makes me wonder if weevil bites are contagious, transformative, with the way the two weevils could feel his pain? anger? rage? Or maybe Weevils ARE moorlocks, so to speak. Weird little David Fincher rip-off, in a lot of ways.
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Post by Queen E on Jan 18, 2007 7:32:11 GMT -5
Huh. This is the first episode of Torchwood I've really found hard to enjoy. Possibly because it was so obviously a Fight Club rip-off, except they stripped all the sociopolitical content from the movie and made it into an extreme sport...so maybe it was more a hybrid between Fight Club and "The Ring" from Angel. But, if Owen was trying to die, why not immediately attack the weevil? We have Ianto saying at the start that Owen has been studying the weevil, and when he enters the cage, they just look at each other. He was horrified at the idea of the weevil being a punching bag, and I don't think that Big Jaw Guy (can't remember his name) correctly interpreted why Owen had no fear...he had no fear because he knew weevils better than anyone in that room, not because he'd given up on life. And the weevil didn't attack until it was startled by Jack.
I think, and I could be wrong, that it was less about "wanting to die" and more about "slipping": becoming what you study. That's why the other story in the episode is about Gwen and Rhys; she is losing her contact with the outside world, even resorting to using the amnesia pill on her boyfriend, and never being "there" when she's at home.
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Post by Queen E on Jan 18, 2007 7:38:20 GMT -5
Of course, there's a big part of me that wants to smack Owen...so he lost the woman he loved; he should be happy he's even capable of feeling for another person, given the seriously sociopathic behavior we've seen thus far.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Jun 19, 2007 18:32:31 GMT -5
Rhys pushed the breaking point? Gwen's promise to keep a hold of her outside life. Probably the hardest job of all of them. Of course, it might help if Jack didn't interrupt Gwen in the middle of dinner. Torchwood's got a competitor? Ring tone. Hee. God, I really want to smack Owen upside the head right now. Gwen has a life outside of Rhys, right? It's not just about holding on to Rhys if he's not right for her, right? Janet? Double standards when it comes to aliens? Gwen confesses about Owen. Gwen's used retcon on Rhys. Dammit. Get it all out in the open, but Rhys is not going to remember, so it's really just for Gwen's benefit. So this guy's just keeping the weevils in his basement to use as punching bags? That's it? Creepy ring tone. Oh, so it's a fight club. Or rather, cage match. Owen felt at peace when he was face to face with death. As opposed to Jack, who felt more alive. And then Jack came blundering in. Do you always know what's best Jack, is that what you truly believe? Staring down the weevil in the end.
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 21:29:42 GMT -5
Jack's out Weevil catching on his own? So, just like he never sleeps, he also never gets a night off? "He's my boss." "Sit the fuck down." "Don't talk to me that way." Well, yeah! 'Cuz I mean, yes, there's relationship issues and promising to work on stuff and take a night off work, etc. But there's also a guy, her boss, who is supposedly a cop of some kind, chasing someone and all bloody? Um. I think I'd be realising my cop significant other probably needs to help out here. Whoa! Rogue Weevil hunters? Ooooh, tough guy Owen. I emphathize with him here. He really is just trying to have a depressed drink and mope and everyone else keeps dragging him into their drama. Ooopsie. Tosh spills the beans about Owen and Diane. Huh. They've actually got me feeling sorry for the Weevils. Slightly telepathic . . . some other Weevil is hurting and this one is feeling it? Guys! Someone is watching you! Why don't you have, like, alien device thingees that would tell you that? They used these warehouses for "storing the bodies of dead G.I.'s. Sometimes you can know too much history." Sometimes when you've lived too much history, eh? Someone's using the Weevils to hurt/kill people? Testing the use of Weevils as weapons? Or . . . ? Threats. Which either means they don't know what Torchwood is, or they think they are bigger and badder and better than TW. Which means they are . . . who?
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 21:45:29 GMT -5
"Get your bony little ass over here." Heh!! ;D Actually, that's a good question that Owen asks. Why not just let the Weevils do it all? If humans are wacking the guy around first, that's may help you figure out what they're doing. Using them as the final part of intimidation if human means don't work? Testing them? Trying to teach them to be violent in a different way? Oh, Gwen. You think you can solve everything if you just care hard enough. Oh, Owen. You think you can solve everything just by lashing out at people, hurt them before they hurt you, be more cynical than everyone else so that you can't possibly be disappointed. Heh! An eel exporter!!! Love watching Tosh in her element. So confident and knowing what the guy will do next. And the eel promotional vid? Perfect! Jack, Jack, Jack. "Don't let it drift." You can't live other people's lives for them, Jack. And you can't have them live life for you, either.
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 22:02:40 GMT -5
"They'd kill me. Everyone." Huh? "You call it Janet?" "Barbara just never seemed right. " ;D ;D Well, a bar fight including stomping the shit out of someone probably helped Owen's cover, but . . . The man has anger issues, dude! Heh!! "The weevil has landed." And Tosh sees another example of Jack's cold and pragmatic side. This whole conversation with the probably connected to the Weevil mystery is making me think of, well, of Fight Club. Are they using the Weevils in some kind of underground arena thing? Fighting for money, crowds, etc.? Oooh. The whole "out of the darkness, something is coming" vibe again. Which is making me wonder now if this is related to Master Prime Minister!
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 22:44:52 GMT -5
Gwen being honest. "I've been sleeping . . having sex with". Name and all. Ah. Confession and retcon. Yeah, "get everything out" doesn't really count when you're planning to have you be the only one who remembers tomorrow. And begging for/ demanding forgiveness? Not likely to work. Sneaky Owen is not fooling anyone, I'm thinking. Yep. Not so much with the fooling. They don't know what the Weevils are, just that they are live punching bags. And no idea who Torchwood are, just that they are getting in the way. The dead guy was a "life choice"? Ah ha!! I am so right about the Fight Club thing! Should have put the tracer in the Weevil. Pizza and tears. (Actually, that was a nicely done crying jag. Very realistic.) Oooh, they text the location of the fight to everyone and he's not off the message list yet! I love how Tosh's snacks and stuff are still all around the computer. ;D Cage match with Weevil. How very insane of them. And yeah, it's not even just an underground bare knuckle fight thing, with betting and stuff. It's got that truly existential wackiness from Fight Club. I knew I got that vibe from the guy when he was talking in his kitchen. Not to mention even the look of the kitchen, all industrial/modern. Interesting how the Weevil appears to just be trying to get away for the first few passes. And they zap it from outside, etc. Playing chicken, really. How long in the cage before they run out. And the dead guy just stayed in, he "wouldn't come out". Owen sooo knows the guy won't shoot him. Oh, is he going to use the low-level telepathy with them? Get the Weevil not to attack? Torchwood to the rescue! "This ends now. Go back to your lives!" Heee! So drama queen. And dork guy wants to be all "no fear" like Owen was. So Jack lets him get munched. "You shouldn't have. No really you shouldn't have. I hate grapes." Heh. Owen wanted to die or face death or what ever (common theme with the TW gang, isn't it?) and Jack "blundered in". "You always know best, that's what you believe, isn't it Jack?" Well, Owen is wacko with the wanting to possibly get munched by the Weevil and all, but he's not necessarily wrong with that opinion about Jack. Oooooh, now he uses the telepathy! Growls and they're scared of him!! Aha!! I was right about that too. 'Cuz back when the first one was whining? My initial thought was that he was reacting to the fight in the bar that Owen was having. I mean, Jack said that Owen was working with them and the telepathy, etc. But then Jack said the thing about them feeling what another Weevil was and I forgot all about it. Heh! **high fives self**
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 22:45:33 GMT -5
If I could bring myself to care about Owen or Gwen, this would be a good episode. Well written, just... I've had enough of the falling apart thing. could they maybe fall together a bit? ETA: episode commentsOh, I care about all the characters, or at least find them interesting. So I thought it was a good ep. And heeeee! plus agreement about the Jack + Weevil = flirting. I love how they keep that continuity of character. He flirted with Gwen when he first met her, with the guy from the past last week, he flirts with Weevils. ;D Just like the Doctor says, he flirts with everyone. ;D
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 22:48:47 GMT -5
If I could bring myself to care about Owen or Gwen, this would be a good episode. Well written, just... I've had enough of the falling apart thing. could they maybe fall together a bit? **nods** They do all seem to be going bug shagging nutso in the same way, don't they? Fight Club all the way, dude. Totally!
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 22:49:41 GMT -5
Huh. This is the first episode of Torchwood I've really found hard to enjoy. Possibly because it was so obviously a Fight Club rip-off, except they stripped all the sociopolitical content from the movie and made it into an extreme sport...so maybe it was more a hybrid between Fight Club and "The Ring" from Angel. But, if Owen was trying to die, why not immediately attack the weevil? We have Ianto saying at the start that Owen has been studying the weevil, and when he enters the cage, they just look at each other. He was horrified at the idea of the weevil being a punching bag, and I don't think that Big Jaw Guy (can't remember his name) correctly interpreted why Owen had no fear...he had no fear because he knew weevils better than anyone in that room, not because he'd given up on life. And the weevil didn't attack until it was startled by Jack. I think, and I could be wrong, that it was less about "wanting to die" and more about "slipping": becoming what you study. That's why the other story in the episode is about Gwen and Rhys; she is losing her contact with the outside world, even resorting to using the amnesia pill on her boyfriend, and never being "there" when she's at home. Nicely put. Slipping.
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Post by Lola m on Nov 17, 2007 22:55:01 GMT -5
Rhys pushed the breaking point? Gwen's promise to keep a hold of her outside life. Probably the hardest job of all of them. Of course, it might help if Jack didn't interrupt Gwen in the middle of dinner. Torchwood's got a competitor? When the guy said the stuff about the darkness coming, that momentarily moved me away from my Fight Club first thought. To some kind of competitor thing too. That actually would have been another interesting story to have done. Really. Because hanging on to "real life" doesn't have to mean staying with Rhys. There's other ways to stay connected. I can't decide if Tosh was more worried Jack has a double standard or that he doesn't. In other words, was she also kind of worried that maybe Jack wouldn't have had a problem with this happening to a human either, if he thought it was the only way to solve something. **nods a lot** Becoming a weevil. Loving the alien!
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Post by beccaelizabeth on Nov 18, 2007 8:51:49 GMT -5
double standard - is what Torchwood is all about. "If it's alien it's ours" They can do what they do cause there's no laws against doing it to aliens. So the idea Jack would treat humans same as aliens is, for Torchwood pov, a problem. But we know he dates aliens no worries, so probably is for treating all the same by their behaviour not species.
also, same double standard is how the fight club gets away with everything, reflecting badly on Torchwood.
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Post by Rachael on Nov 18, 2007 12:32:59 GMT -5
If I could bring myself to care about Owen or Gwen, this would be a good episode. Well written, just... I've had enough of the falling apart thing. could they maybe fall together a bit? ETA: episode commentsOMG, agreed. I am so bored of Gwen's relationship with her boyfriend, I just can't tell you. And the whole "hey, forgive me right after I give you an amnesia pill and confess to cheating on you" bit. WTF? First off, did she really think a double betrayal confession was likely to extract forgiveness in 60 seconds? Second, it's so very very selfish. Even more selfish than the ordinary confessing to an affair to make oneself feel better. THIS way, she'd know he'd forgive her, and can keep doing whatever the hell she wanted, always knowing that her doormat of a boyfriend would take it off her. Meh, anyway. We rated this one "boring" in our household. The whole "Ring + Fight Club" bit did nothing for us, either. Although, and I'm turning into a creepy metrosexual as I say this, I suddenly find Owen's character much more compelling than Gwen's. Which, never thought that could happen.
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