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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:07:30 GMT -5
JW has said over and over in interviews that this was going to be his last season of Buffy, period. Then why didn't he take better care of developing the story arc. Why then was Giles, so off kilter. Xander and Anya should have slowly grown closer, not just in the last few eps, it would have made the ending more bittersweet. Xander should have had better parts and more dialogue. And yes, the eye of something thing that prophesized to Giles and Anya. There was somewhere a mention of the end of the slayer line, I don't remember where, maybe an article somewhere, but...it was dropped quickly to being the last guardian of the Hellmouth. I don't have that on tape and would have to pay more attention. Script time again.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:08:01 GMT -5
//What Buffy did to Caleb. Not only did she cut him in half, she plainly started from the crotch and worked up, rather than starting at his head and working down. I imagine for most guys, even imagining that would be a fairly major owie.// Considering what a chauvinist that bastard was, I think he got his just deserts. Although I still like the idea of Xander having been able to watch, then as soon as he was down, Xander could have said, "I saw THAT!" and then promptly urinated on his remains.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:08:19 GMT -5
Amanda didn't survive? Aww. I liked her much more than I liked Kennedy. At least Rona is hanging on at the end. I'm surprised Kennedy left Willow, who was drained from the spell, unguarded and alone. Gail
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:08:40 GMT -5
"Ah, the vampire with a soul, once he fulfills his destiny, will Shanshu. Become human. - It's his reward." I think that's vague enough to mean any vampire who fulfills his destiny. So? What you think?
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:09:31 GMT -5
No, it was in there. Just before....gulp, he turned to ashes. It was the last thing he said. I watched in horror as he died and now I'm all confused. I've read several articles stating that he will join the cast of Angel next year. They will need some new, (pardon the pun) blood. Charisma Carpenter and Vincent Kartheiser aren't coming back next season. So, now I'll have to wait in awful suspense until I hear it confirmed somewhere that he will be on Angel. I hope so. Spike is just beyond too cool to kill off. But if he doesn't, he went out with a very definite Spike bang!
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:09:56 GMT -5
//And Spike cried out something about drowning, which will, no doubt mean something in some episode of AtS next year or the year after.// Yes, I recognized the quote -- he was drowing in footwear, he cried from his dream. Someone on here posted that earlier, last night I think, and left me completely confused because they aimed the question at me -- which episode did Spike dream about drowning in footwear, they asked me. Little did any of us know, that individual was posting a nasty spoiler attempt.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:10:15 GMT -5
//JW has said over and over in interviews that this was going to be his last season of Buffy, period. // Note he only said that after SMG said she was quitting. While she was iffy, he was iffy. I think him saying that it was the last season of Buffy was BS -- if she'd have been more interested, and as long as the fan base was there and the network support, he'd have happily done more. I just think he was being diplomatic toward Sarah when he said that.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:10:57 GMT -5
//But it felt as much like a new beginning as an end, hence no goodbyes.// I agree, Dave, JW left everything wide open -- we have about a million possibilities now for the future -- as many as we now have Slayers. Everyone who survived has limitless options -- or, as Buffy herself said, "it's not time for wishes, it's time for choices." And that, I think, is ultimately how JW not only brings the season opener to its conclusion, he also ties AtS S4 into BtVS S7. TFE told us, in Buffy guise, in "Lessons" that "It's about power." Well, what is power? Ultimately, it's about the ability to make a choice. Free will. What Jasmine was taking away from the world, what the shamans took away from the First Slayer and all subsequent Slayers up to Buffy -- the ability to determine one's own future, one's own life. Buffy didn't choose to be the Slayer. She told us countless times during S1-S7 that she wanted a different life. Buffy's uniqueness among the Slayers, and her true power, always derived from the choices that she made as a Slayer: To love her family and her friends; to do what she thought was right, even though it was "against the rules"; to sacrifice what she loved to save the world, regardless of what she wanted. She chose to be a force for good. So now JW leaves us with infinite choices. I believe we'll see these people again, someday. Whether it's on AtS, or on a subsequent spin-off, or a movie -- who knows? Remember the mantra: Must trust Joss. I'm still weepy from the episode. I laughed. I cried. I miss miss these characters, but oh, how glad I am that they've enriched my life. Laura
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:11:16 GMT -5
David said: then as soon as [Caleb] was down, Xander could have said, "I saw THAT!" and then promptly urinated on his remains. David, more and more I realize you're a man, if not after my own heart, at least after my own fashion. Couldn't have said (or imagined) it better myself. Sadistic gits, aren't we? Tee hee. Nan
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:11:53 GMT -5
//I think that's vague enough to mean any vampire who fulfills his destiny.// The destiny that they give on Angel is that the vampire's destiny is a role he has to play in an apocolypse, which Spike just did.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:12:16 GMT -5
I think Spike said something about drowning, and yes, Amanda got killed by the Ubervamps.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:12:56 GMT -5
Betsy said: "Totally agree with you on that one! Spike has definitely moved on from the whole unrequited love thing. The episode was a shining Spike bonanza!!" Oh, and see - in my excited state and my non-brevity took over, I couldn't even think of the simple, cohesive term "unrequited love" - yes! And wasn't our Spike the GREATEST - a GENUINE "Shiny Happy People"! "But the only thing I didn't appreciate was NO BIG SMOOCHIES for B&S! How could Joss do that to us? Angel got the liplock; Spike should have had equal time!" Oh, yes - ABSOLUTELY PITIFUL! In fact, Spike had not ONE SMOOCHIE this season, except in "Lies" and then in flashback!! It was a GOOD one, with him and Dru, but still... I guess we could try to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear and just say that Buffy was giving Angel a LITERAL "kiss off". ;-) But oh, hell yeah! I don't really care WHO she is as long as she treats him well, but DAMMIT - I SO want to see Spike have a GOOD LOVE INTEREST (or at least a good snog 'n shag interest) on "Angel" next Fall!! In fact, *I'LL* even be so magnanimous and volunteer if no other girl wants the job! "Also, did you see the way they sliced Anya like a side of beef? EEWWW" I saw her get stabbed, but I guess so much was happening that I didn't really catch the gory details. Saw it coming, but yet, that poor gal... and now we'll NEVER know what it was about her and bunnies that always upset her so.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:13:29 GMT -5
Did anyone also notice the cartoon drawing he had taped to the punching bag that was supposed to be Angel? It even had fangs. That was too funny. The whole episode tonight was chock full of funny lines and the usual Whedon genius of mixing the funny and morose with the tender and tearful. This episode just proves once again that this show was always above and beyond innovative, thought provoking, witty, profound and all around fun. It's gonna be very hard to let it go.
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:14:00 GMT -5
Yeah, Daveid, but it didn't say the vampireS with soulS, it said THE VAMPIRE WITH A SOUL. I think that qualifies as only one vampire. Of course I could be wrong, but...
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Post by Dalton on Mar 17, 2004 22:14:28 GMT -5
I think the arcs weren't as tight as they could have been, because midseason, the writers were trying to leave all sorts of possibilities open for spinoffs. I think the Beloxja's Eye comment was intended to pave the way for a Faith spinoff somehow by posing the question, "Who is the real Slayer?". That got dropped. I think they flung SITs at us like peanut butter to a wall, hoping one of them might "stick". Then when Eliza D. turned down the spinoff, they had to kind of wrap up what they could. I'm still kind of scratching my head wondering what purpose Faith really served in these last five episodes. It was nice that she was there and redeemed and everything...but ultimately unneccesary.
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