|
Post by artemis on May 2, 2008 21:05:23 GMT -5
i loved this episode so much, i'd give it a hug if i could. more after sleep
|
|
|
Post by Sue on May 3, 2008 7:00:03 GMT -5
Ancient Rome. TARDIS translation circuit. Latin comes across as Celtic. Welsh. <snip> But then he offers the family salvation. Wonder what the effects of that are going to be. Ah, a temporary rift in Pompeii caused the visions. Rome Six Months Later. Yep, fallout.
The Doctor and Donna became their household gods. So is this supposed to be ominous or just wrapping the episode up nicely?Did the originally broadcast (in the UK) version have a scene that we didn't get in the U.S.? Sometimes I'm not paying close attention but I don't recall this. Left the family on the hill crying, while D and D were leaving in the Tardis. But I did miss the first few minutes---was that where this was?
|
|
|
Post by Queen E on May 3, 2008 9:15:14 GMT -5
Ancient Rome. TARDIS translation circuit. Latin comes across as Celtic. Welsh. <snip> But then he offers the family salvation. Wonder what the effects of that are going to be. Ah, a temporary rift in Pompeii caused the visions. Rome Six Months Later. Yep, fallout.
The Doctor and Donna became their household gods. So is this supposed to be ominous or just wrapping the episode up nicely?Did the originally broadcast (in the UK) version have a scene that we didn't get in the U.S.? Sometimes I'm not paying close attention but I don't recall this. Left the family on the hill crying, while D and D were leaving in the Tardis. But I did miss the first few minutes---was that where this was? Must have been cut out. The final scene is the family living in Rome six months later, with the daughter wearing the latest Roman fashions and the son studying medicine. His mother tells him to remember to thank the household gods, in a callback to the earlier scene, and it is a marble inset of the Doctor, Donna, and the Tardis. A bit cheesy, but hey.
|
|
|
Post by artemis on May 3, 2008 17:45:41 GMT -5
Did the originally broadcast (in the UK) version have a scene that we didn't get in the U.S.? Sometimes I'm not paying close attention but I don't recall this. Left the family on the hill crying, while D and D were leaving in the Tardis. But I did miss the first few minutes---was that where this was? it's not just you, sue - it wasn't in the US version of the episode. which is too bad, IMHO. i wonder why they cut it out?
|
|
|
Post by artemis on May 3, 2008 17:50:02 GMT -5
Interesting episode! I really like how they are establishing Donna as a companion; she's mouthy with a good moral sense and just enough knowledge of the Doctor to know what to say during a moral crisis. And she's 1) old enough to know her own mind and not be overwhelmed by his superior knowledge (as I think Rose sometimes was, and 2) not attracted to him, a la Martha, which is kind of the same issue as point 1, since both lead to not being as strong a voice as was needed in this episode. Both these first 2 episodes show a nice bit of continuity from "The Runaway Bride" in terms of the decision the Doctor made with regard to the Racnoss. Not that I am at all picking on Rose or Martha! I like how each companion we've seen has a different purpose and effect. Rose helped the Doctor admit and come to some kind of terms with the events of the Time War; Martha helped connect him (literally, in "Last of the Time Lords") with the rest of humanity. Donna, on the other hand, seems to help keep him in check, to keep him grounded when he has to make certain god-like decisions. I could be all wrong about this, but that's what I have so far. Did anyone catch the "she's coming back" (or something like that) that the seer said to the Doctor? Hmm, wonder who that could refer to? i totally agree with the companion thoughts. i found this episode especially striking in the differences illustrated between martha and donna. if i'm correctly recalling, martha seemed to pretty much take what the doctor said at his word - like in the first few episodes, it seemed like she was asking questions to establish the ground rules and just accepting his answers. to me donna seems to be much more "but WHY is it this way? why can't it be this other way?" and personally i think someone being questioned about stuff like that every so often is good for the person - to really think through why they do what they do, or think what they think, or believe what they believe - so that they can reevaluate it and better understand it themselves.
|
|
|
Post by artemis on May 3, 2008 18:19:04 GMT -5
having studied ancient greek culture in greece, i especially loved the recreation of ancient roman life and of the seer culture in particular. sibyl seers (sibylla is prophetess in greek) really existed in the ancient world. one of the major theories is that they were a pre-classical-greek-mythology tradition that was adapted by the classical greeks into their religion. in classical times, they were primarily associated with apollo and tended to be present at his worship sites, like delphi and cumae, the latter being a greek colony in today's italy that some pompeiians could have visited.
i spent a little while trying to find a decent link about them to post for y'all, but there doesn't seem to be very much good information on the web about them, at least not that i could uncover in a little while's time. however, i did find this quote, which i thought was kinda neatly relevant to this episode:
|
|
|
Post by Queen E on May 3, 2008 18:29:43 GMT -5
Did the originally broadcast (in the UK) version have a scene that we didn't get in the U.S.? Sometimes I'm not paying close attention but I don't recall this. Left the family on the hill crying, while D and D were leaving in the Tardis. But I did miss the first few minutes---was that where this was? it's not just you, sue - it wasn't in the US version of the episode. which is too bad, IMHO. i wonder why they cut it out? It's a time thing. The BBC is funded solely by the licensing fees every TV owner in England has to pay to watch TV, so there are no commercials on the BBC at all. I think this episode ran a little under 50 minutes, and since on American TV, you have to jam in at least 15 minutes of advertising, something had to get cut out. You should see the horrors BBC America inflicted on "Life on Mars." LoM usually ran about 1 hour; they would cut almost 20 minutes out of each episode. I'm surprised anyone could make any sense out of what was left.
|
|
|
Post by artemis on May 3, 2008 18:49:22 GMT -5
it's not just you, sue - it wasn't in the US version of the episode. which is too bad, IMHO. i wonder why they cut it out? It's a time thing. The BBC is funded solely by the licensing fees every TV owner in England has to pay to watch TV, so there are no commercials on the BBC at all. I think this episode ran a little under 50 minutes, and since on American TV, you have to jam in at least 15 minutes of advertising, something had to get cut out. yeah, i understand that they cut stuff. it just seems to me like cutting the entirety of the very last scene was especially stupid. yikes - and that was even bbc's own u.s. channel. i feel especially grateful now that they didn't seem to cut very much of torchwood.
|
|
|
Post by Lola m on May 12, 2008 12:19:30 GMT -5
Did the originally broadcast (in the UK) version have a scene that we didn't get in the U.S.? Sometimes I'm not paying close attention but I don't recall this. Left the family on the hill crying, while D and D were leaving in the Tardis. But I did miss the first few minutes---was that where this was? Must have been cut out. The final scene is the family living in Rome six months later, with the daughter wearing the latest Roman fashions and the son studying medicine. His mother tells him to remember to thank the household gods, in a callback to the earlier scene, and it is a marble inset of the Doctor, Donna, and the Tardis. A bit cheesy, but hey. Huh. Yes, they did cut that here. Probably a timing thing - need to fit in more commercials, ya know. Hmmmm. So, this fits in with all the other "the Doctor is God" imagery stuff we've gotten, eh?
|
|
|
Post by Lola m on May 12, 2008 12:22:38 GMT -5
Interesting episode! I really like how they are establishing Donna as a companion; she's mouthy with a good moral sense and just enough knowledge of the Doctor to know what to say during a moral crisis. And she's 1) old enough to know her own mind and not be overwhelmed by his superior knowledge (as I think Rose sometimes was, and 2) not attracted to him, a la Martha, which is kind of the same issue as point 1, since both lead to not being as strong a voice as was needed in this episode. Both these first 2 episodes show a nice bit of continuity from "The Runaway Bride" in terms of the decision the Doctor made with regard to the Racnoss. Not that I am at all picking on Rose or Martha! I like how each companion we've seen has a different purpose and effect. Rose helped the Doctor admit and come to some kind of terms with the events of the Time War; Martha helped connect him (literally, in "Last of the Time Lords") with the rest of humanity. Donna, on the other hand, seems to help keep him in check, to keep him grounded when he has to make certain god-like decisions. I could be all wrong about this, but that's what I have so far. Did anyone catch the "she's coming back" (or something like that) that the seer said to the Doctor? Hmm, wonder who that could refer to? i totally agree with the companion thoughts. i found this episode especially striking in the differences illustrated between martha and donna. if i'm correctly recalling, martha seemed to pretty much take what the doctor said at his word - like in the first few episodes, it seemed like she was asking questions to establish the ground rules and just accepting his answers. to me donna seems to be much more "but WHY is it this way? why can't it be this other way?" and personally i think someone being questioned about stuff like that every so often is good for the person - to really think through why they do what they do, or think what they think, or believe what they believe - so that they can reevaluate it and better understand it themselves. Donna definitely is one of those companions that challenge and question the Doctor. And I also like how she is willing to question and challenge herself too, and how she'll learn new information and that will sometimes cause her to change her opinons and so on. Frankly, I just always love seeing new Companions, how they interact, what they bring to the mix, etc. And love seeing new incarnations of the Doctor, too! It's all fun.
|
|
|
Post by S'ewing S'cubie on May 31, 2008 17:08:23 GMT -5
While I find Donna to be a very abrasive person I do think she's an interesting change from Martha's puppy-eyed adoration. I also like that while the Doctor was able to occasionally overlook Martha's opinions and feelings, Donna won't let him run her over. The biggest difference is that Martha is deeply in love and Donna isn't.
|
|
|
Post by artemis on Nov 24, 2008 6:41:06 GMT -5
Sci Fi Channel cut a bunch of stuff, as you may recall, when they aired the episodes here in the u.s. i specifically remembered that they cut the last scene of this episode, so when it played on BBC America Channel here this weekend, i taped it because i was curious whether they'd make the same cuts (even though i know it doesn't matter much any more since the DVD came out this week in the u.s. anyway). the previously unseen scene was there. i didn't remember the episode well enough to be sure they didn't cut anything smaller from other scenes, but i thought it was interesting that they chose not to cut this part. i thought i'd pass it on in case anyone cares.
|
|
|
Post by Lola m on Dec 2, 2008 21:44:45 GMT -5
Sci Fi Channel cut a bunch of stuff, as you may recall, when they aired the episodes here in the u.s. i specifically remembered that they cut the last scene of this episode, so when it played on BBC America Channel here this weekend, i taped it because i was curious whether they'd make the same cuts (even though i know it doesn't matter much any more since the DVD came out this week in the u.s. anyway). the previously unseen scene was there. i didn't remember the episode well enough to be sure they didn't cut anything smaller from other scenes, but i thought it was interesting that they chose not to cut this part. i thought i'd pass it on in case anyone cares. Interesting! And a good decision on the part of BBC America.
|
|
|
Post by artemis on Dec 6, 2008 14:36:30 GMT -5
they've also been airing bits of an interview with Stephen Moffat during the commercial breaks of the season's episodes (and sometimes as ads during other shows, too). i've found his comments to be interesting, most especially the one where he said that he felt like writing for a comparably older and comedic actress had raised the standard of writing on the show.
|
|
|
Post by Anne, Old S'cubie Cat on Jul 8, 2010 19:06:03 GMT -5
Kitty and I have been recording and watching Tennant episodes as they run on BBCA during the day, and just watched this one today. I like Donna; I can see where she's coming from. I can probably see that a bit too much, with the clingy controlling mom. Is it also superficial of me to be pleased that she's a bit older and a bit more, let's say, womanly of figure? Because that doesn't hurt either, as far as I'm concerned. Also, she's a good companion for The Doctor right now. She doesn't defer to him, she pulls him up short and grounds him when he needs it, but she's also all wide-eyed and excited about the whole new universe he's sharing with her. I think it was important for The Doctor to see, through Donna, that it's okay if you can't save everybody. Sometimes it's enough to do what you can, like, save one family. By the way, I gather there was a lot cut out in previous US airings? We did get that last scene in Rome, household gods and all. Yes it was cheesy, but it rather made the episode for me - Donna was right.
|
|