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Post by Onjel on Nov 7, 2008 21:21:13 GMT -5
Dick Cheney is far from my favorite guy, but I think it would be interesting and exciting to meet him. I mean - say what you will - the guy has had an interesting life, and it's not like anyone would be asking me to marry him. One evening to help raise some funds? All I have to do is listen to a Cheney fan sing his praises, and maybe a speech from him? And I may have a chance to meet him and talk to him? Sure. I would do it, no problem. To me, doing so doesn't imply that I, personally, think a lot of Dick Cheney. It just means that I think a lot of my cause, and that I think a guy whose been in those sorts of "halls of power" would no doubt be interesting to meet and talk to. I'd have my limits here - this kind of reasoning wouldn't work for me if say, Adolf Hitler was the guest of honor, but Cheney I could manage. I listened to an interview on NPR of a journalist who was researching Dick Cheney's life to write a book about him and the journalist is a left-leaning journalist and stated that he would have been more than happy to find dirt of the type that has been bandied about, on Cheney. Try as he did, and he looked everywhere, he found nothing but that Cheney, far from being the venal person portrayed, truly believed that he was doing the best thing for his country. I've always said, fear the true believers. And, contrary to popular belief, Cheney divested himself of all his Halliburton stock, giving it to charity, before he became veep. I got the sense that this journalist was both disappointed in not finding the dirt he was looking for and admiring of the man he actually found existed. The interview surprised me as did the results of the research. At the end of it all, I came away not hating or despising the guy, but still fearing his zeal. And, he's an avid fly-fisherman, spending time on the Gallatin and Madison Rivers in Montana, apparently.
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Post by SpringSummers on Nov 7, 2008 23:09:52 GMT -5
Dick Cheney is far from my favorite guy, but I think it would be interesting and exciting to meet him. I mean - say what you will - the guy has had an interesting life, and it's not like anyone would be asking me to marry him. One evening to help raise some funds? All I have to do is listen to a Cheney fan sing his praises, and maybe a speech from him? And I may have a chance to meet him and talk to him? Sure. I would do it, no problem. To me, doing so doesn't imply that I, personally, think a lot of Dick Cheney. It just means that I think a lot of my cause, and that I think a guy whose been in those sorts of "halls of power" would no doubt be interesting to meet and talk to. I'd have my limits here - this kind of reasoning wouldn't work for me if say, Adolf Hitler was the guest of honor, but Cheney I could manage. I listened to an interview on NPR of a journalist who was researching Dick Cheney's life to write a book about him and the journalist is a left-leaning journalist and stated that he would have been more than happy to find dirt of the type that has been bandied about, on Cheney. Try as he did, and he looked everywhere, he found nothing but that Cheney, far from being the venal person portrayed, truly believed that he was doing the best thing for his country. I've always said, fear the true believers. And, contrary to popular belief, Cheney divested himself of all his Halliburton stock, giving it to charity, before he became veep. I got the sense that this journalist was both disappointed in not finding the dirt he was looking for and admiring of the man he actually found existed. The interview surprised me as did the results of the research. At the end of it all, I came away not hating or despising the guy, but still fearing his zeal.And, he's an avid fly-fisherman, spending time on the Gallatin and Madison Rivers in Montana, apparently. Well said, and pretty much the way I feel about Cheney.
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Post by Sue on Nov 9, 2008 21:27:28 GMT -5
Nate Silver (538) is already handicapping the 2010 senate races.
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Post by Sue on Nov 10, 2008 10:45:46 GMT -5
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Post by Sue on Nov 10, 2008 12:44:10 GMT -5
Obama's books are #1 and #2 at Amazon, but Amazon is sold out of copies of The Audacity of Hope---although they have alternate sellers with "vintage" copies.
And are now 3 and 4 on NYT, but will probably go to 1 and 2 when they update on Thursday.
I find this interesting. Are people buying them as collector's items and coffee table books or to actually learn more about him? Wouldn't you have read them before voting, if that were the case?
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Post by Squeemonster on Nov 10, 2008 12:58:21 GMT -5
Obama's books are #1 and #2 at Amazon, but Amazon is sold out of copies of The Audacity of Hope---although they have alternate sellers with "vintage" copies. And are now 3 and 4 on NYT, but will probably go to 1 and 2 when they update on Thursday. I find this interesting. Are people buying them as collector's items and coffee table books or to actually learn more about him? Wouldn't you have read them before voting, if that were the case?Nope. I didn't read them. And I've been considering buying one, eventually--not for collector's items, but because I am interested in learning even more about him.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Nov 10, 2008 12:58:53 GMT -5
Obama's books are #1 and #2 at Amazon, but Amazon is sold out of copies of The Audacity of Hope---although they have alternate sellers with "vintage" copies. And are now 3 and 4 on NYT, but will probably go to 1 and 2 when they update on Thursday. I find this interesting. Are people buying them as collector's items and coffee table books or to actually learn more about him? Wouldn't you have read them before voting, if that were the case? My guess is that people are buying them for historical value, but I could be wrong.
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Post by Julia, wrought iron-y on Nov 10, 2008 13:15:38 GMT -5
Ah, Nashville. Jan. 19: MLK Day Jan. 20: Obama Inauguration Jan. 22: Nashville has special election on referendum to stipulate that all city services be offered in English only]. (polls are running 47% against and 46% in favor )
Under the article on the English only vote is an article about the Spanish immersion magnet elementary school that has a waiting list. All math and science classes are taught only in Spanish.
What kills me is that all the evidence ever gained says that people benefit from being exposed to other languages in their daily life, and that compliance to laws and regulations is enhanced by access to the text in a first language, even for those who speak English competently. Canada, people, observe it! Julia, noting also that some other-than-native-english-speakers are from families who have been in the US way longer than the average Nashvillian, and that's not counting those who speak Athabaskan and Utoaztecan languages...
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Post by Julia, wrought iron-y on Nov 10, 2008 13:18:14 GMT -5
Obama's books are #1 and #2 at Amazon, but Amazon is sold out of copies of The Audacity of Hope---although they have alternate sellers with "vintage" copies. And are now 3 and 4 on NYT, but will probably go to 1 and 2 when they update on Thursday. I find this interesting. Are people buying them as collector's items and coffee table books or to actually learn more about him? Wouldn't you have read them before voting, if that were the case?Nope. I didn't read them. And I've been considering buying one, eventually--not for collector's items, but because I am interested in learning even more about him. Given the number of "quotations" from those books that were being forwarded around the Right Emailweb it's possible that some people are buying those to prove he's going to try to take down the White Race. I expect some of them will shortly expire of cognative dissonance. Julia, just mean, that's me.
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Post by Rachael on Nov 10, 2008 13:39:08 GMT -5
Obama's books are #1 and #2 at Amazon, but Amazon is sold out of copies of The Audacity of Hope---although they have alternate sellers with "vintage" copies. And are now 3 and 4 on NYT, but will probably go to 1 and 2 when they update on Thursday. I find this interesting. Are people buying them as collector's items and coffee table books or to actually learn more about him? Wouldn't you have read them before voting, if that were the case? Souvenirs. Collector's items. Like the four newspapers we bought the day after the election, I think.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Nov 10, 2008 13:43:18 GMT -5
Obama's books are #1 and #2 at Amazon, but Amazon is sold out of copies of The Audacity of Hope---although they have alternate sellers with "vintage" copies. And are now 3 and 4 on NYT, but will probably go to 1 and 2 when they update on Thursday. I find this interesting. Are people buying them as collector's items and coffee table books or to actually learn more about him? Wouldn't you have read them before voting, if that were the case?Nope. I didn't read them. And I've been considering buying one, eventually--not for collector's items, but because I am interested in learning even more about him. I haven't read them either, and I will probably do the same.
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Post by SpringSummers on Nov 10, 2008 15:38:11 GMT -5
Ah, Nashville. Jan. 19: MLK Day Jan. 20: Obama Inauguration Jan. 22: Nashville has special election on referendum to stipulate that all city services be offered in English only]. (polls are running 47% against and 46% in favor )
Under the article on the English only vote is an article about the Spanish immersion magnet elementary school that has a waiting list. All math and science classes are taught only in Spanish.
? What is wrong with offering city services in other languages? Hmmm. That said, language "immersion" schools sound like a good idea for English-speaking little ones who want to be bilingual. Nothing works better for learning a language than just throwing a little kid into the pool. When they are elementary school age, they will learn in no time flat. I saw my cousins coming from Italy learn English so fast they were at the top of their classes within months. Kids are like sponges on that stuff. The contrast between the kids and their parents was stark - my cousins learned English very quickly, and sounded like native Ohioans in no time; my aunts and uncles never learned it completely and always had very heavy accents. The brain is a mysterious organ. And going into a related topic: While I'm totally for non-English speaking schools for American kids to learn a second language, I'm totally against them for immigrant kids. They need to learn English. Nothing works better than sending them to English-speaking schools. Having parents that can't speak English while you are in an English speaking school can be challenging, but you can work-around it - it's very doable. I would never trade the "learning to speak English like everyone else" experience I got from first grade onward, for "being able to take homework/notes in Italian home to my parents." Heck, I knew how to translate; all immigrant kids do. That's their job.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Nov 10, 2008 16:07:10 GMT -5
Ah, Nashville. Jan. 19: MLK Day Jan. 20: Obama Inauguration Jan. 22: Nashville has special election on referendum to stipulate that all city services be offered in English only]. (polls are running 47% against and 46% in favor )
Under the article on the English only vote is an article about the Spanish immersion magnet elementary school that has a waiting list. All math and science classes are taught only in Spanish.
? What is wrong with offering city services in other languages? Hmmm. That said, language "immersion" schools sound like a good idea for English-speaking little ones who want to be bilingual. Nothing works better for learning a language than just throwing a little kid into the pool. When they are elementary school age, they will learn in no time flat. I saw my cousins coming from Italy learn English so fast they were at the top of their classes within months. Kids are like sponges on that stuff. The contrast between the kids and their parents was stark - my cousins learned English very quickly, and sounded like native Ohioans in no time; my aunts and uncles never learned it completely and always had very heavy accents. The brain is a mysterious organ. And going into a related topic: While I'm totally for non-English speaking schools for American kids to learn a second language, I'm totally against them for immigrant kids. They need to learn English. Nothing works better than sending them to English-speaking schools. Having parents that can't speak English while you are in an English speaking school can be challenging, but you can work-around it - it's very doable. I would never trade the "learning to speak English like everyone else" experience I got from first grade onward, for "being able to take homework/notes in Italian home to my parents." Heck, I knew how to translate; all immigrant kids do. That's their job. The politics of language education is interesting. It's well known that there's a critical period where language acquisition is incredibly easy, but most countries put second language classes in grade levels when the students are well past that critical period. There was a discussion on one of the lj language communities about it a little while ago. I see no reason for students not to attend English only schools; everyone I know in that situation (speak foreign language with parents at home, speak English elsewhere) has ended up perfectly bilingual. But I wonder if the resistance to immersion schools is inspired by some of the same politics as above.
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Post by Rachael on Nov 13, 2008 13:46:44 GMT -5
Sue asked, in the main thread, about Boston Legal this week. Some Open Topic thoughts:
I'm not okay with abortion-on-demand, morally. Denny was dead-on in his "liberals aren't really sure they're right" spiel. I know that a developing fetus is human, and alive. I can't decide at what point that life starts to have real value to me.
Abortion for sex selection is disgusting. But I will not concede any part of my abortion rights, largely because the opposition won't compromise. They can't, if they really believe every abortion is murder. But if there can be no compromise on their side, there can't be any on mine, either.
That said, in my ideal world, a woman would have 30 days after finding out she was pregnant to have an abortion. I think a month is enough time to decide what you want to do. The exceptions would be in cases where there's a serious fetal defect discovered later, or a threat to the mother's life or health.
How you'd enforce it, since home pregnancy tests mean no one would know when she really found out, I have no idea.
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Post by Julia, wrought iron-y on Nov 13, 2008 14:06:55 GMT -5
Sue asked, in the main thread, about Boston Legal this week. Some Open Topic thoughts: I'm not okay with abortion-on-demand, morally. Denny was dead-on in his "liberals aren't really sure they're right" spiel. I know that a developing fetus is human, and alive. I can't decide at what point that life starts to have real value to me. Abortion for sex selection is disgusting. But I will not concede any part of my abortion rights, largely because the opposition won't compromise. They can't, if they really believe every abortion is murder. But if there can be no compromise on their side, there can't be any on mine, either. That said, in my ideal world, a woman would have 30 days after finding out she was pregnant to have an abortion. I think a month is enough time to decide what you want to do. The exceptions would be in cases where there's a serious fetal defect discovered later, or a threat to the mother's life or health. How you'd enforce it, since home pregnancy tests mean no one would know when she really found out, I have no idea. Some times social reasons are just as threatening as medical ones, though, and thirty days barely puts one into the end of the first trimester, if that. I had a friend who got pregnant, intentionally, with a man who subsequently decided he couldn't deal, and abandoned her when she was at 16 weeks. She was living on a goat farm, with her two year old, a wood stove, a complicated and hinky series of pastures, two of her does just bred, and a crazy mother who often needed intervention and institutionalization... having to deal with her physical and social reality and a pregnancy was more than she felt able to cope with. As soon as "small, reasonable" restrictions are imposed, there's a possibility that a woman will be required to continue a pregnancy which, in her particular situation, will push her past her particular survival point: where the lack of access to safe and legal abortion will force her to choose pennyroyal, or a coathanger, or any of the deadly means which were common in my early memory. Unless you are living that woman's individal life, you can't judge how, say, continuing a pregnancy with no support from a partner, or caring for a Down syndrome child over its lifetime, is going to impact her ability to cope. Julia, my other big reason for being a pro-choice extremist- knowing a woman who was beaten to death when she told her husband she was pregnant for the fourth time in three years- is OK with the thirty day thing.
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