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Post by KMInfinity on May 18, 2008 12:08:36 GMT -5
well, I hope the grandfather is saved...I loved the image of him searching the sky with his telescope and seeing the tardis... I was thinking about Martha's warning to Donna earlier in the episode about those who stood too close to The Doctor's "fire" and that it might mean a very bad end for Granddad.
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Post by Kate (K8) on May 18, 2008 13:26:40 GMT -5
well, I hope the grandfather is saved...I loved the image of him searching the sky with his telescope and seeing the tardis... I was thinking about Martha's warning to Donna earlier in the episode about those who stood too close to The Doctor's "fire" and that it might mean a very bad end for Granddad. I just assumed he survived. I didn't consider that he wasn't saved. I like the character and the interaction with Donna's mother so I hope they stick around.
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Post by Sue on May 18, 2008 16:52:01 GMT -5
when the show made a point of martha specifying she didn't have a gun, i knew that was going to spell trouble for her down the road. overall i liked this episode - nice pacing, with what i thought was a good mix of silly banter and action and emotional depth. after all the things that have gone wrong with popular technology on the new series, maybe humans should start avoiding fad tech like they now, avoid london on christmas, though. ;D lots of interesting little bits and ideas in this episode - from the idea of a species of warriors who can't turn their back on their enemy in battle to the image of donna's grandpa waving excitedly from down the street to the colonel calling the doctor hypocritical for preferring his weapons to be hidden to the guy who offhandedly justified his imminent extermination of the earth with, "it was never big enough for me" (i imagine there are other people who would feel similarly). i wish that the conclusion weren't two weeks away for those of us watching on american tv. did they air on the same night in the uk like they seem to often do? Not in this case; the second part of this episode aired the following Friday. It looks like next week you get treated to a double bill of the films Solar Attack and Scorcher. Lucky you. Holiday weekend---Memorial day. The never air new eps of anything on holidays. Actually, kind of thoughtful since some people DO spend the day with families, etc.
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Post by Queen E on May 18, 2008 18:05:02 GMT -5
Not in this case; the second part of this episode aired the following Friday. It looks like next week you get treated to a double bill of the films Solar Attack and Scorcher. Lucky you. Holiday weekend---Memorial day. The never air new eps of anything on holidays. Actually, kind of thoughtful since some people DO spend the day with families, etc. True. I also found out that Doctor Who is not airing in the UK next weekend either, due to the stupid Eurovision song contest. *sigh* Now I have to figure out how to watch the season finale, since it'll air after I've left the UK for the summer.
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Post by Onjel on May 18, 2008 19:42:01 GMT -5
Holiday weekend---Memorial day. The never air new eps of anything on holidays. Actually, kind of thoughtful since some people DO spend the day with families, etc. True. I also found out that Doctor Who is not airing in the UK next weekend either, due to the stupid Eurovision song contest. *sigh* Now I have to figure out how to watch the season finale, since it'll air after I've left the UK for the summer. We might be able to remedy that. ;D Remember the Titanic.
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Post by Queen E on May 19, 2008 6:50:59 GMT -5
True. I also found out that Doctor Who is not airing in the UK next weekend either, due to the stupid Eurovision song contest. *sigh* Now I have to figure out how to watch the season finale, since it'll air after I've left the UK for the summer. We might be able to remedy that. ;D Remember the Titanic. Hee! You are awesome.
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Post by Rachael on May 19, 2008 19:50:30 GMT -5
So, the bit where they have to keep Martha alive for her memories? This I loved. Because so many shows just assume the "clone" will be a simple duplicate. With all the same memories. Yeah, no. We don't know a lot about how memories are made yet, but we are pretty damned sure they're experience-dependent. So that was cool. Telepathic link to the real Martha, or some such thing. But if they can do that, why take the planet by force? Why not simply clone and replace world leaders and do it the quiet way? Well, Sontarans LIKE force, I guess. Also? What do they want the bloody planet for, anyway?
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Post by Onjel on May 19, 2008 20:05:46 GMT -5
So, the bit where they have to keep Martha alive for her memories? This I loved. Because so many shows just assume the "clone" will be a simple duplicate. With all the same memories. Yeah, no. We don't know a lot about how memories are made yet, but we are pretty damned sure they're experience-dependent. So that was cool. Telepathic link to the real Martha, or some such thing. But if they can do that, why take the planet by force? Why not simply clone and replace world leaders and do it the quiet way? Well, Sontarans LIKE force, I guess. Also? What do they want the bloody planet for, anyway? Sontarans are the best soldiers in the universe or some such thing. Point is, they are warriors. I'm betting they don't usually resort to quiet maneuvering as a first option. ;D I think they just like conquering and don't really want the planet for anything at all.
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Post by Lola m on May 22, 2008 12:10:43 GMT -5
So, the bit where they have to keep Martha alive for her memories? This I loved. Because so many shows just assume the "clone" will be a simple duplicate. With all the same memories. Yeah, no. We don't know a lot about how memories are made yet, but we are pretty damned sure they're experience-dependent. So that was cool. Telepathic link to the real Martha, or some such thing. But if they can do that, why take the planet by force? Why not simply clone and replace world leaders and do it the quiet way? Well, Sontarans LIKE force, I guess. I was gonna say, where's the Sontaranian fun in that? I put it in the same category as why not just do it the quiet way. Because they want to fight and this is the next planet they've decided to fight. And now that they know the Doctor-who-ignored-them-and-didn't-let-them-play-in-the-big-Time-War is involved? Triple the reason!
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Post by artemis on May 24, 2008 13:47:32 GMT -5
memorial day is so early this year i'd temporarily forgotten it's this weekend. well, we will see part two next weekend anyway. i agree about the sontarans - i think they just like fighting and just like conquering. from what they said to the human teenager who's been helping them, it sounds like they (and the teen) are planning to simply leave earth after they destroy it, but i might be misunderstanding that...
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Post by S'ewing S'cubie on May 31, 2008 17:14:29 GMT -5
You know, I just realized something. The Doctor listens to Donna more than he did to Martha, even though Martha:
1. Is far more highly educated than Donna; 2. Is an experienced TARDIS traveler, while Donna has just begun traveling; 3. Saved the world (Someone please do a Donna-as-Spike writeup here, I'm getting dizzy).
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Post by Rachael on Jun 2, 2008 20:34:40 GMT -5
You know, I just realized something. The Doctor listens to Donna more than he did to Martha, even though Martha: 1. Is far more highly educated than Donna; 2. Is an experienced TARDIS traveler, while Donna has just begun traveling; 3. Saved the world (Someone please do a Donna-as-Spike writeup here, I'm getting dizzy). I don't really see the comparison with Spike, though. People didn't pay attention to Spike because he was fundamentally untrustworthy (until very recently) - it takes time to build up trust, and he'd spent over a century making sure people had abundant reasons NOT to trust him. I mean, as late as Season 6 he was still working behind the scenes to screw over people he loved. As for Martha, she has a fundamental flaw when it comes to the Doctor: her approach. She's all puppy-love, bendable, gives-way...very stereotypically girly. Not at all assertive most of the time. Whereas both Rose and Donna are more aggressive, more direct, more assertive - and with the Doctor, as in life, it seems that assertive wins the day over, well, somewhat meek.
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Post by Queen E on Jun 2, 2008 21:20:37 GMT -5
You know, I just realized something. The Doctor listens to Donna more than he did to Martha, even though Martha: 1. Is far more highly educated than Donna; 2. Is an experienced TARDIS traveler, while Donna has just begun traveling; 3. Saved the world (Someone please do a Donna-as-Spike writeup here, I'm getting dizzy). I don't really see the comparison with Spike, though. People didn't pay attention to Spike because he was fundamentally untrustworthy (until very recently) - it takes time to build up trust, and he'd spent over a century making sure people had abundant reasons NOT to trust him. I mean, as late as Season 6 he was still working behind the scenes to screw over people he loved. As for Martha, she has a fundamental flaw when it comes to the Doctor: her approach. She's all puppy-love, bendable, gives-way...very stereotypically girly. Not at all assertive most of the time. Whereas both Rose and Donna are more aggressive, more direct, more assertive - and with the Doctor, as in life, it seems that assertive wins the day over, well, somewhat meek. Agreed. Although not entirely her fault. She meets the strange (and attractive man), meets him again and is intrigued, he winks at her (flirty), a life-or-death situation ensues, he kisses her, and then she uses her last breath to revive him after his heroic self-sacrifice, and then offers to whisk her away in time and space. All in one episode. Got to say, I'd be hard put not to feel something after all that. Plus, until The Lazarus Experiment, she was always on the back foot, as he kept (somewhat rudely) insisting that this was "one trip only" that kept getting extended. Mixed signals much?
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Post by Rachael on Jun 2, 2008 21:23:19 GMT -5
I don't really see the comparison with Spike, though. People didn't pay attention to Spike because he was fundamentally untrustworthy (until very recently) - it takes time to build up trust, and he'd spent over a century making sure people had abundant reasons NOT to trust him. I mean, as late as Season 6 he was still working behind the scenes to screw over people he loved. As for Martha, she has a fundamental flaw when it comes to the Doctor: her approach. She's all puppy-love, bendable, gives-way...very stereotypically girly. Not at all assertive most of the time. Whereas both Rose and Donna are more aggressive, more direct, more assertive - and with the Doctor, as in life, it seems that assertive wins the day over, well, somewhat meek. Agreed. Although not entirely her fault. She meets the strange (and attractive man), meets him again and is intrigued, he winks at her (flirty), a life-or-death situation ensues, he kisses her, and then she uses her last breath to revive him after his heroic self-sacrifice, and then offers to whisk her away in time and space. All in one episode. Got to say, I'd be hard put not to feel something after all that. Plus, until The Lazarus Experiment, she was always on the back foot, as he kept (somewhat rudely) insisting that this was "one trip only" that kept getting extended. Mixed signals much? Oh, yeah. I mean, he was totally rebounding her. Thing is, though, she LET herself be Rebound Girl. Even after she knew it. Me, I'd've stayed on for the time travel, but no mousy second-guessing myself. I mean, Rose had strong feelings for him, too, but she was more than able to hold her own. Granted, she knew he had a thing for her, too.
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Post by artemis on Jun 7, 2008 11:06:20 GMT -5
it seems to me like the imbalance between the level of strength of their feelings for each other led to an imbalance of power in their relationship - like martha would not only second-guess herself, but also just quiet down about something even if she still thought she was right/had the better plan/whatever. from the bits we've seen of her on torchwood and doctor who since she left the doctor's side, it seems to me like she has grown more assertive and self-confident now that she's on her own than she was when she was travelling with him.
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