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Post by Sue on Nov 21, 2006 18:47:12 GMT -5
Matt's (that's Greg Grunberg's character name, right?) wife---she seems to be to a parallel to Simone.
Matt and wife. Peter and Simone.
wife and Simone definitely (at least thus far) supporting characters. At least Simone has a name. (And isn't she in the upfront credits as a series regular? Is Eden?) So maybe more down the line.
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Post by Rob on Nov 21, 2006 18:53:07 GMT -5
As Karen just pointed out, they're gonna think Peter killed Jackie. Which sucks. Of course. But, Claire can help him. I'm thinking more along the lines of the FBI coming to Odessa. That'll connect Matt Parkman with Peter and Claire.
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Post by RAKSHA on Nov 21, 2006 19:08:00 GMT -5
Neither. I find the portrayal unconvincing - she seems more like a prop than a character. In my opinion - others may clearly vary. While all the other characters seem vivid and real, with personalities and stories of their own, she seems to exist only to further the plot, and so I find her uninteresting - she could as easily be, for example, a newspaper headline that appears at a critical moment. I haven't decided yet if that's because the writers haven't fleshed the character out sufficiently, or if the actress simply doesn't work for me. Other characters without powers are interesting - Ando, for example, is well-characterized and it's easy to care what becomes of him. Mohinder, obviously, also falls into that category. And other characters who've gotten far less screen time were instantly better filled-in - Charlie, for example, feels like a real person. I think they've done some things with her character recently to give it more depth. Of course, she is not given a lot of screen time (well, none of the characters are with this large a cast, but especially the secondary, non-powers people). But also, I can see that the character does have some elements of cliche (woman trying to save her junky boyfriend, tempted by another, falling for the guy caring for her dying dad, etc.). And they haven't really given her any "quirky/wacky" elements, like you often do with secondary characters, to help them stand out. Like the show-dog stuff with Claire's mom. But at least to me, when they let her actual emotional reactions come out, I find her interesting. Well, and I loved the shot of her in the rain with the red umbrella and all. I'm a sucker for pretty visuals. ;D And yes, of course the usual IMHO always applies. It would be no fun at all if we all had the same feelings and reactions to characters or plots or so on. Just a brief note that not all people who show dogs are "quirky/wacky". I've known many of them. Most of them don't use the dog, or dogs, as a physical/emotional shield from weirdness or difficulty, the way Claire's mom seems to be doing. (I keep wanting to yell at her - put the Pom down, he has legs, he can walk, it would do him good to move around!) I've known a woman who has children and show dogs, and she is very engaged in her children's lives, her husband's lives, teaches part-time, and doesn't use the dogs to hide.
Simone kinda bores me too. I love Ando, who is normal, and of course, Mohinder is outstanding. ClairesDad is interesting, and has no super-powers.
GAIL
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Post by Matthew on Nov 21, 2006 19:16:10 GMT -5
Wow. That's very interesting, presuming it's true. Have we yet gotten any sort of "official" confirmation that these graphic novels should be considered canon? Dunno. I'm hoping and digging around on the 9th Wonders site for some sort of "yep, it's part of the storytelling canon" confirmation, but ain't found it yet. LOVE the hell out of the things, though, for they fill in so many neat little bits and pieces. Hope they're canon. From a Q&A with two of the writers from the show, linked from the 9th Wonders website: (From October 30th) The online comic seems to be gaining some traction. Do we have any numbers on readership?
We were told by the powers that be that there have been very promising traffic numbers for the "Heroes" website, and that half of which are for the webcomic. We're hoping as people see that it enhances. That being said, if we can get one kid in Michigan to read it and utter "Cool…" we've done our job.
Also with the online comics, when are they written? Are they planned out while an episode is being written, or after?
They are planned concurrently. We decide the best story to tell as it correlates with the episode. However, we just learned that the webcomics will be weekly, even when the show is off the air. So, check it out as we expand our pantheon and introduce new characters online. So I'm guessing they're pretty much "canon": the Q & A for the next week suggests that one check out the web comic for more information on D. L, too. So, Whee!!!!
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 19:45:55 GMT -5
I was wondering that too. Was it because he didn't want to tell her he knew about her? Not tell her what he's been up to? Because he wants them to stay just "father and daughter" for a while? Maybe he was hoping she'd come to him with the truth? And now that she is going to tell him, do we think he'll also confide in her completely? Clever you! I only thought of that when we saw Peter looking at the picture of the other cheerleader. I suddenly was all "ooh, what if Sylar also picks the wrong girl? That might help Claire escape!". Which is rather callous toward the cruel girl. I mean, yes she was a bitca, but she didn't really deserve to get her head sliced open. GAIL [/color][/quote] You ask a good question. I am now wondering if he's another one that was nabbed and then released by Cheer!daddy's group. [/quote] No, poor Jackie didn't deserve death - perhaps it was a cautionary note about her ethics, she stole what was due to Claire, and reaped the shadow side of a hero's glory - the vulnerability to twistos/psychos/stalkers.
And hey, kudos to quiet, mild-mannered Peter - he's saved the cheerleader, and with her, hopefully the world.
If I'd been ClairesDad, she'd been on a plane to the other side of the country, in disguise, with Eden and Psychic Damper Dude guarding her 24/7 as soon as I saw those pictures - not grounded in her room with unlocked windows. Had ClairesDad known of her abilities?
Also, if ClairesDad and PomLady couldn't have kids, where did the little brother come from? Another 'special' adoption?
GAIL [/quote] Yes, he knows of her abilities...he knew she was "special" he also saw the tape. And Claire's dad said they'd had problems conceiving.. not that they "couldn't." Vlad
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 19:54:54 GMT -5
Maybe Hiro is still trying to save Charlie and that's why he hasn't come back? Hmph. Major paradox issues in that case. 'Cause if he succeeded, regardless of how long it took him, we should already know. But you can't count on television writers to remember that. I have some faith in these guys. I think Hiro is currently doing somehting else "same real-time" Even tho' he can shift time and space, so far they haven't shown that he can really be more than one place at a time. Or realized that he can. Part of hte growth of the hero, you know? But I think (and am hoping) that we'll have an explanation we can all get behind why he didn't pop back in and tell Ando something. Here's a thought... maybe Hiro's powers don't work in the past because whatever event awakened them doesn't work then... He could be "stuck" there, until say the eclipse. Not that this logic has anything to do with him not poppping back in since he'd have a week or two after the eclipse to start time hopping again... but it's an interesting thought anyway. Vlad
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 20:15:11 GMT -5
It looks like everybody has said everything already. Sigh. Stupid time zones. Except maybe for this: I believe it happens sometimes that a childless couple adopts a child, then becomes pregnant. One reads about these things. I would, however, like to point out, for what it's worth, that I said last week that soccer boy was a spirit guide. But nobody listens to me, grumble grumble grumble... Anne, especially my nearest, dearest and cats ETA: And furthermore, I suggested last week that the radioactive guy might be the cause of the New York nuclear explosion. Now everybody's doing it... Anne, maybe I should just be Marci for a while Um, sweetie... you weren't the only person (nor I think the first) that thought Ted was potentially involved in the upcoming NY explosion last week... or even the week before. I think no one may have commented overtly becuase everyone was pretty much in aggreement/leaning that way already. Now there is more evidence leaning even mor that way so people are discussing it again. Really, no one should be feeling like Marci here. In fact, I have been enjoying the show discussions more over HEROES than I have over a lot of shows recently. Everyone is contributing. Debate is lively. HEROES poses questions but seems to be paying off with eventual answers regularly as compared to some other shows *coughLOST,BSGcough*, which is making it a more enjoyable watch ...for me at least. Vlad
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 20:20:38 GMT -5
Totally kick ass! Just lounging against the tree and then quietly - "you don't want to hurt me . . . . go to sleep". Her power in particular would take a LOT of moral fortitude to NOT misuse. I mean, flying, healing, painting....those are pretty much just personal. Reading minds could be easily misused. And the stopping time to cheat at poker. But influencing the mind/wills of those around you? Seems like you'd have to be a very good person not to do so conciously ...and I wonder how much you would do it unconsciously? Really, couldn't she have influenced ClairesDad to not want to force Isaac to paint, since she thought that was a bad decision? I agree with yu about her power! My reasoning on why she can't/doesnt influence Claire's dad: Mr. Haiti! We know that he had the big dude blocking mentally for him vs. Matt when they abducted Matt. So maybe Mr. Haiti is blocking her as well. So, evectively, Claires dad and Haiti (and possibly Matt) are immune to her even, tempered, cultured speechifying. Vlad
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Post by Shan on Nov 21, 2006 20:34:05 GMT -5
My sentiments as well. Even her dad seemed more pertinent. Huh.... Mr. Deveaux wasn't supposed to be a talent, as such, but we get a clear indication (through Simone, heh) that Peter was communicating with him in his dream, just prior to Mr. Devaux's death: maybe Peter's power is some sort of hyper-empathy that can be applied to talents and non-talents alike....Would fit perfectly in with him being a nurse. Yeah, I also had a thought about the empathy angle. But my point about Mr. Deveaux was that he was, in comparison to his daughter, a more clearly and interestingly drawn character despite his relatively short screen-time.
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Post by Shan on Nov 21, 2006 20:50:11 GMT -5
I think they've done some things with her character recently to give it more depth. Of course, she is not given a lot of screen time (well, none of the characters are with this large a cast, but especially the secondary, non-powers people). But also, I can see that the character does have some elements of cliche (woman trying to save her junky boyfriend, tempted by another, falling for the guy caring for her dying dad, etc.). And they haven't really given her any "quirky/wacky" elements, like you often do with secondary characters, to help them stand out. Like the show-dog stuff with Claire's mom. But at least to me, when they let her actual emotional reactions come out, I find her interesting. Well, and I loved the shot of her in the rain with the red umbrella and all. I'm a sucker for pretty visuals. ;D And yes, of course the usual IMHO always applies. It would be no fun at all if we all had the same feelings and reactions to characters or plots or so on. Just a brief note that not all people who show dogs are "quirky/wacky". I've known many of them. Most of them don't use the dog, or dogs, as a physical/emotional shield from weirdness or difficulty, the way Claire's mom seems to be doing. (I keep wanting to yell at her - put the Pom down, he has legs, he can walk, it would do him good to move around!) I've known a woman who has children and show dogs, and she is very engaged in her children's lives, her husband's lives, teaches part-time, and doesn't use the dogs to hide.
Simone kinda bores me too. I love Ando, who is normal, and of course, Mohinder is outstanding. ClairesDad is interesting, and has no super-powers.
GAIL Oh, you raise a good point about the PomMom. There has to be a lot of stuff she's using the dog to hide behind, what with having lived with HRG all these years. When I watch her, I don't see "crazy dog-show person" I see "voluntarily oblivious spouse of HRG-guy using obsession special interest as socially acceptable distraction from reality person".
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 20:51:47 GMT -5
Well, I personally find Simone boring and the least convincing character. D.L., OTOH, is fascinating. But needs more screen time before I can comment much on his character. And I don't think anyone's forgotten that being around Niki isn't safe - but, as Matthew suggests, she's certainly not gonna see it that way. Good comments, everyS'cubie. I don't know if I can unvague my thoughts, but here goes: I think that the heart of the Niki!Jessica/DL conflict is an unresolved custody battle. Each of them thinks that the other is an unfit parent and dangerous for their son. Neither of them has the whole story, but they are both trying to do what they think is best for Micah. That conflict would be there whether there were superpowers involved or not; the powers add extra dimension to the argument, not to mention danger to all concerned. Speculative scenario - Niki is able to take back control, realises what's going on, is properly horrified, and is able to sit down and actually talk to DL rationally. She knows now that her mirror self committed the murders DL went to prison for. I'd like to think that at some point Niki (because Jessica isn't going to do it) and DL will be able to talk, and maybe use their shared strengths to protect Micah. Or they could just go on playing fugitive and hunter and taking pot-shots at each other until somebody really gets hurt... I dunno.Which is so very typical of divorce/custody battles! I don't think either of them are "unfit parents" providing they can each overcome their specific circumstances: DL needs to get cleared somehow and Niki has to be able to control Jessica. Until then, Micah shouldn;t really be with "either" of them. If I had to lean one way or the other, I would say DL at this point, becuase although he is a fugitive, he is appearing to do everything pretty "right" so far... even to the point of correcting mistakes he has made. And he is not "personally" dangerous to Micah... the only real danger to Micah (leaving out Sylar/Claire's dad, of course) is Niki/Jessica. Vlad
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 21:02:52 GMT -5
Why? Because she lacks a power? Or because she dumped Isaac for Peter? Neither. I find the portrayal unconvincing - she seems more like a prop than a character. In my opinion - others may clearly vary. While all the other characters seem vivid and real, with personalities and stories of their own, she seems to exist only to further the plot, and so I find her uninteresting - she could as easily be, for example, a newspaper headline that appears at a critical moment. I haven't decided yet if that's because the writers haven't fleshed the character out sufficiently, or if the actress simply doesn't work for me. Other characters without powers are interesting - Ando, for example, is well-characterized and it's easy to care what becomes of him. Mohinder, obviously, also falls into that category. And other characters who've gotten far less screen time were instantly better filled-in - Charlie, for example, feels like a real person. I find her boring because.. she's "jsut the girlfriend." The only thing we've seen is that she loved her father and is torn between two men. Whoopteedoo, you know? And the actress herself doesnt have any... anything for me. She's bland. She's a non-entity. A plot device. I am glad you pointed out Charlie in your example, becasue for a character that was jsut introduced in one episode that died by the end, I think the entire community of HEROES watchers all went "NO! Not her! I liked her!" And you can't do that without the character feeling "real" Vlad
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Post by Shan on Nov 21, 2006 21:11:04 GMT -5
Neither. I find the portrayal unconvincing - she seems more like a prop than a character. In my opinion - others may clearly vary. While all the other characters seem vivid and real, with personalities and stories of their own, she seems to exist only to further the plot, and so I find her uninteresting - she could as easily be, for example, a newspaper headline that appears at a critical moment. I haven't decided yet if that's because the writers haven't fleshed the character out sufficiently, or if the actress simply doesn't work for me. Other characters without powers are interesting - Ando, for example, is well-characterized and it's easy to care what becomes of him. Mohinder, obviously, also falls into that category. And other characters who've gotten far less screen time were instantly better filled-in - Charlie, for example, feels like a real person. I find her boring because.. she's "jsut the girlfriend." The only thing we've seen is that she loved her father and is torn between two men. Whoopteedoo, you know? And the actress herself doesnt have any... anything for me. She's bland. She's a non-entity. A plot device. I am glad you pointed out Charlie in your example, becasue for a character that was jsut introduced in one episode that died by the end, I think the entire community of HEROES watchers all went "NO! Not her! I liked her!" And you can't do that without the character feeling "real" Vlad I know what you mean. Eden was also "just the neighbor" but was she that "meh" or was there something more? I mean before the "you'll be back" snogging of Mohinder? Me, I don't think so.
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Post by Vlad on Nov 21, 2006 21:25:16 GMT -5
I find her boring because.. she's "jsut the girlfriend." The only thing we've seen is that she loved her father and is torn between two men. Whoopteedoo, you know? And the actress herself doesnt have any... anything for me. She's bland. She's a non-entity. A plot device. I am glad you pointed out Charlie in your example, becasue for a character that was jsut introduced in one episode that died by the end, I think the entire community of HEROES watchers all went "NO! Not her! I liked her!" And you can't do that without the character feeling "real" Vlad I know what you mean. Eden was also "just the neighbor" but was she that "meh" or was there something more? I mean before the "you'll be back" snogging of Mohinder? Me, I don't think so. Well, with her... I sorta liked the actress... and there was the whole question of "is she a plant or not?" It made her much more interesting. Simone.. we know. Or at least have no reason to suspect she's anything other than what we have seen. And while she is a fine "person," she's not a very interesting character. She serves her purpose and I am fine with that... but I don't plan on ever being a "fan", you know? And it's not jsut because she doesn't have a power. Ando is interesting , Peter's mom is interesting, the FBI agent working with Matt is interesting. Vlad
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Post by Shan on Nov 21, 2006 21:41:01 GMT -5
I know what you mean. Eden was also "just the neighbor" but was she that "meh" or was there something more? I mean before the "you'll be back" snogging of Mohinder? Me, I don't think so. Well, with her... I sorta liked the actress... and there was the whole question of "is she a plant or not?" It made her much more interesting. Simone.. we know. Or at least have no reason to suspect she's anything other than what we have seen. And while she is a fine "person," she's not a very interesting character. She serves her purpose and I am fine with that... but I don't plan on ever being a "fan", you know? And it's not jsut because she doesn't have a power. Ando is interesting , Peter's mom is interesting, the FBI agent working with Matt is interesting. Vlad Y'all watch differently than I do, probably because you watch more shows in general. I didn't think of her being a plant at all so the whole HRG connection was a big surprise to me.
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