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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 19:55:08 GMT -5
Part IV
Bernard!
Sawyer wises up.
Storm comes.
Is Desmond actually going to let
Desmond derails.
I'm afraid you're beyond penance, Desmond.
Bigger plans than Desmond being a monk?
Running towards, rather than running away. Ref what Desmond told Penny about the race.
What am I supposed to do now?
So is this when Desmond joins the military?
And this conversation again.
Racing. Like the sail around the world.
Moment of truth.
Pinned his guitar instead. Whatever that means.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 20:03:16 GMT -5
Coda
Charlie dresses down Desmond.
I keep saving your life, and what good has it done? It's just going to keep happening over and over again.
More a commentary on Desmond's own life, I think.
Desmond never finding his niche, much like Charlie never finding his.
Also connection with Locke, in his mysterious (to others) determination to do this or that.
And here's where he meets Penny.
It's easier to make grape jelly than wine.
Just a step along the path.
Had he heard the name Penny before? He gave a strange look when she introduced herself.
Nope, not her.
Who is this?
She recognizes Desmond.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 20:24:31 GMT -5
There was the easter egg! The lady who didn't sell Desmond the ring was in the photo on the monk's desk. WHOA! Wonder what THAT means. |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 20:29:14 GMT -5
Heeee! Whistling BOTRK moment. ;D Sacrifice and tests and a punch in the nose. Themes, much?  Jack brings the sardonic truism. "Enjoy it. I'm sure something will go wrong soon enough." See Kate flirt with Jack. See Jack sort of flirt with Kate. Flirt, Kate, flirt. Smile enigmatically, Jack, smile enigmatically. Flirt! Smile! Go sit with new girlfriend, Jack. See Kate go all frowny. See Kate go jump Sawyer's bones in an effort to use sex to assuage her emotional pain. Smooch, Kate, smooch! (And take off his shirt already, woman!) Shut up, Sawyer, and hit that! Bring the sex and angst like nobody's business. 
People, people, people. How many times will you ignore my sensible and logical advice. Threesome. There's always room for a threesome.OK, back to the beach blanket bingo crew. Heeee! The guy with a hook story in Korean and Hurley still falls for it. ;D Des is expecting Penny to come there, for sure. Ooops. Helicopter go boom.  Ah - the lights in the sky are a jumper? Parachute with emergency beacon thingee? *Nods sagely* The longer this goes on, the more and more I believe they actually will form a threesome. ;D |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 20:34:46 GMT -5
Interesting observations from Jeff Jensen: The early flashback scenes echoed with resonances to Lost episodes past. When Ruth accused Desmond of cold feet, I recalled how Jack struggled with jitters in the days before his wedding to Sarah. When Brother Campbell commended Desmond on completing his vow of silence as part of his monastery initiation, I recalled that Locke had a sentence of silence that was part of his reconnection process with the Island. And when Brother Campbell told Desmond that he was ''one of us,'' of course, I thought of last week's Juliet episode, entitled ''One of Us.'' All this in the wake of the most recent Desmond episode, in which his bid to get a respectable job with Penelope's father mirrored the almost-forgotten season 1 episode in which a smack-addled, post-Driveshaft Charlie tried to go straight by working for his girlfriend's Dad. Weird how this one character mirrors and twins a broad swath of others, from Jack to Locke to Charlie. Worth a future Doc Jensen theory, perhaps.
It's clear from the flashbacks that from an early age, Desmond has been driven by a desire for belonging and validation. At the same time, he also suffers from a profound case of ''I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For''-itus. I'd love to know in a future episode what role Desmond's early life played in the formation of this personality; in his last episode, we were told he was left to raise his bothers after the death of his father. What happened there? (And why do I have a hunch that the Lost-cited book The Brothers Karamazov — about four brothers and a dead dad — might have something to do with it?). Whatever the cause of his restlessness, Desmond seems chronically incapable of staying engaged, on mission, committed, for a prolonged period of time before something in him breaks down and spurs him elsewhere, usually into the bottom of a bottle. The lesson that Brother Campbell believed he needed to learn was the value of personal sacrifice, a lesson which the Liam Neeson sound-alike illustrated for Desmond by citing the famous Biblical story in which God asked Abraham to kill his son Isaac as an offering. Abraham was torn, but was willing to do it — and at the last second, got a deus ex machina reprieve from the Lord himself. Talk about mirroring and symmetry: You can find this Biblical catch-22 in...Genesis, chapter 22.Very cool. Many more connections than I picked up on. Drew Goddard's all about the connections, isn't he? What is your source for all this info, BTW? |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 20:39:19 GMT -5
More from Jensen, adding intriguing layers to what we saw: The Bridge on the River Kwai and Catch-22 Actually, I have never seen the former, and never read the latter. But did you know that the famous whistling tune from Kwai actually had lyrics back in the day? It's true. Unfortunately, we can't print them, because they're all about...Hitler's testicles. Specifically, how Hitler and all his right-hand men either had only one testicle or no testicles at all. I could apply this to Ben and the Others, but in the name of good taste, let us note that Kwai and Catch-22 both share similar themes concerning the madness of war, and move on to... Seriously?  |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 20:44:22 GMT -5
But however she's related to the monk, she must have told him that Desmond's destiny was not at the monastery. Because even getting drunk in the wine cellar wouldn't have caused expulsion on the spot from any monastery I've ever heard of. She knew that Desmond wasn't *supposed* to buy the ring, so she knew about his *destiny.* Very true! I did have the impression, even without noticing the pic of the lady on the monk's desk, that he was letting Desmond go for deeper reasons than having a bad day and getting drunk in the wine cellar. He did seem to know that the monastery was just not for Desmond. And I must agree with said monk. Desmond does not belong in a monastery. What do they call the head monk . . . the Abbot? Is that right? I no longer remember this sort of stuff very well. I am a disgrace to my blue and white and gray plaid jumper. I should see if I can find a picture of our old HS uniforms on the web somewhere . . . Abbot, yes. Once attended church at a monastery. Monks are very cool. Actually it was an abbey. But they were monks. Not sure what difference that makes. |
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Post by SpringSummers on Apr 21, 2007 21:20:38 GMT -5
More from Jensen, adding intriguing layers to what we saw: The Bridge on the River Kwai and Catch-22 Actually, I have never seen the former, and never read the latter. But did you know that the famous whistling tune from Kwai actually had lyrics back in the day? It's true. Unfortunately, we can't print them, because they're all about...Hitler's testicles. Specifically, how Hitler and all his right-hand men either had only one testicle or no testicles at all. I could apply this to Ben and the Others, but in the name of good taste, let us note that Kwai and Catch-22 both share similar themes concerning the madness of war, and move on to... Seriously? Yes, I know this little ditty. It goes like this, to the "marchy" sound of the tune involved: Hitler - had only one big ball
Goering - had two but they were small
Himmler - had something similar
And Goebels -had no balls - at all.I have no idea where this originally came from, but I learned it from my husband, back in college. |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 21, 2007 21:30:05 GMT -5
Seriously? Yes, I know this little ditty. It goes like this, to the "marchy" sound of the tune involved: Hitler - had only one big ball
Goering - had two but they were small
Himmler - had something similar
And Goebels -had no balls - at all.I have no idea where this originally came from, but I learned it from my husband, back in college. Thanks, and Hee! |
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Post by Lola m on Apr 23, 2007 22:02:37 GMT -5
Heeee! Whistling BOTRK moment. ;D Sacrifice and tests and a punch in the nose. Themes, much? Jack brings the sardonic truism. "Enjoy it. I'm sure something will go wrong soon enough." See Kate flirt with Jack. See Jack sort of flirt with Kate. Flirt, Kate, flirt. Smile enigmatically, Jack, smile enigmatically. Flirt! Smile! Go sit with new girlfriend, Jack. See Kate go all frowny. See Kate go jump Sawyer's bones in an effort to use sex to assuage her emotional pain. Smooch, Kate, smooch! (And take off his shirt already, woman!) Shut up, Sawyer, and hit that! Bring the sex and angst like nobody's business.
People, people, people. How many times will you ignore my sensible and logical advice. Threesome. There's always room for a threesome.OK, back to the beach blanket bingo crew. Heeee! The guy with a hook story in Korean and Hurley still falls for it. ;D Des is expecting Penny to come there, for sure. Ooops. Helicopter go boom. Ah - the lights in the sky are a jumper? Parachute with emergency beacon thingee? *Nods sagely* The longer this goes on, the more and more I believe they actually will form a threesome. ;D From your fingers to the writer's minds! Oooh, that sounded kinda dirty . . . but you know what I mean, yeah?  |
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Post by Lola m on Apr 23, 2007 22:09:10 GMT -5
Interesting observations from Jeff Jensen: The early flashback scenes echoed with resonances to Lost episodes past. When Ruth accused Desmond of cold feet, I recalled how Jack struggled with jitters in the days before his wedding to Sarah. When Brother Campbell commended Desmond on completing his vow of silence as part of his monastery initiation, I recalled that Locke had a sentence of silence that was part of his reconnection process with the Island. And when Brother Campbell told Desmond that he was ''one of us,'' of course, I thought of last week's Juliet episode, entitled ''One of Us.'' All this in the wake of the most recent Desmond episode, in which his bid to get a respectable job with Penelope's father mirrored the almost-forgotten season 1 episode in which a smack-addled, post-Driveshaft Charlie tried to go straight by working for his girlfriend's Dad. Weird how this one character mirrors and twins a broad swath of others, from Jack to Locke to Charlie. Worth a future Doc Jensen theory, perhaps.
It's clear from the flashbacks that from an early age, Desmond has been driven by a desire for belonging and validation. At the same time, he also suffers from a profound case of ''I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For''-itus. I'd love to know in a future episode what role Desmond's early life played in the formation of this personality; in his last episode, we were told he was left to raise his bothers after the death of his father. What happened there? (And why do I have a hunch that the Lost-cited book The Brothers Karamazov — about four brothers and a dead dad — might have something to do with it?). Whatever the cause of his restlessness, Desmond seems chronically incapable of staying engaged, on mission, committed, for a prolonged period of time before something in him breaks down and spurs him elsewhere, usually into the bottom of a bottle. The lesson that Brother Campbell believed he needed to learn was the value of personal sacrifice, a lesson which the Liam Neeson sound-alike illustrated for Desmond by citing the famous Biblical story in which God asked Abraham to kill his son Isaac as an offering. Abraham was torn, but was willing to do it — and at the last second, got a deus ex machina reprieve from the Lord himself. Talk about mirroring and symmetry: You can find this Biblical catch-22 in...Genesis, chapter 22.Very cool. Many more connections than I picked up on. Drew Goddard's all about the connections, isn't he? What is your source for all this info, BTW? I've also been musing on the actual original catch-22 itself and how it might apply to the ep and the show. If you're crazy, then you don't have to fly missions anymore. All you have to do is is ask not to fly anymore. But if you ask, then you're scared for your life and that's sensible and sane. So therefore you're not crazy and you have to fly. And the ones that are truly crazy never ask. So they keep flying. So, I start wondering . . .. who on the island is asking "not to fly" and therefore is sane and has to keep going? And who is crazy and is not asking to stop? That's some catch, that catch 22. |
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Post by Sara on Apr 24, 2007 15:46:38 GMT -5
Interesting observations from Jeff Jensen: The early flashback scenes echoed with resonances to Lost episodes past. When Ruth accused Desmond of cold feet, I recalled how Jack struggled with jitters in the days before his wedding to Sarah. When Brother Campbell commended Desmond on completing his vow of silence as part of his monastery initiation, I recalled that Locke had a sentence of silence that was part of his reconnection process with the Island. And when Brother Campbell told Desmond that he was ''one of us,'' of course, I thought of last week's Juliet episode, entitled ''One of Us.'' All this in the wake of the most recent Desmond episode, in which his bid to get a respectable job with Penelope's father mirrored the almost-forgotten season 1 episode in which a smack-addled, post-Driveshaft Charlie tried to go straight by working for his girlfriend's Dad. Weird how this one character mirrors and twins a broad swath of others, from Jack to Locke to Charlie. Worth a future Doc Jensen theory, perhaps.
It's clear from the flashbacks that from an early age, Desmond has been driven by a desire for belonging and validation. At the same time, he also suffers from a profound case of ''I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For''-itus. I'd love to know in a future episode what role Desmond's early life played in the formation of this personality; in his last episode, we were told he was left to raise his bothers after the death of his father. What happened there? (And why do I have a hunch that the Lost-cited book The Brothers Karamazov — about four brothers and a dead dad — might have something to do with it?). Whatever the cause of his restlessness, Desmond seems chronically incapable of staying engaged, on mission, committed, for a prolonged period of time before something in him breaks down and spurs him elsewhere, usually into the bottom of a bottle. The lesson that Brother Campbell believed he needed to learn was the value of personal sacrifice, a lesson which the Liam Neeson sound-alike illustrated for Desmond by citing the famous Biblical story in which God asked Abraham to kill his son Isaac as an offering. Abraham was torn, but was willing to do it — and at the last second, got a deus ex machina reprieve from the Lord himself. Talk about mirroring and symmetry: You can find this Biblical catch-22 in...Genesis, chapter 22.Very cool. Many more connections than I picked up on. Drew Goddard's all about the connections, isn't he? What is your source for all this info, BTW? Jeff Jensen writes about Lost for Entertainment Weekly; his articles appear online at ew.com. |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 24, 2007 18:49:14 GMT -5
Very cool. Many more connections than I picked up on. Drew Goddard's all about the connections, isn't he? What is your source for all this info, BTW? Jeff Jensen writes about Lost for Entertainment Weekly; his articles appear online at ew.com. Thanks. |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 24, 2007 18:54:24 GMT -5
Very cool. Many more connections than I picked up on. Drew Goddard's all about the connections, isn't he? What is your source for all this info, BTW? I've also been musing on the actual original catch-22 itself and how it might apply to the ep and the show. If you're crazy, then you don't have to fly missions anymore. All you have to do is is ask not to fly anymore. But if you ask, then you're scared for your life and that's sensible and sane. So therefore you're not crazy and you have to fly. And the ones that are truly crazy never ask. So they keep flying. So, I start wondering . . .. who on the island is asking "not to fly" and therefore is sane and has to keep going? And who is crazy and is not asking to stop? That's some catch, that catch 22. Completely random thought: maybe substitute "not wanting to fly" with "wanting to leave the island." If you're crazy, then can leave the island. All you have to do is is ask to leave. But if you ask, then you're scared for your life and that's sensible and sane. So therefore you're not crazy and you have to stay on the island. And the ones that are truly crazy never ask. So they stay on the island. |
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Post by Lola m on Apr 29, 2007 11:36:50 GMT -5
I've also been musing on the actual original catch-22 itself and how it might apply to the ep and the show. If you're crazy, then you don't have to fly missions anymore. All you have to do is is ask not to fly anymore. But if you ask, then you're scared for your life and that's sensible and sane. So therefore you're not crazy and you have to fly. And the ones that are truly crazy never ask. So they keep flying. So, I start wondering . . .. who on the island is asking "not to fly" and therefore is sane and has to keep going? And who is crazy and is not asking to stop? That's some catch, that catch 22. Completely random thought: maybe substitute "not wanting to fly" with "wanting to leave the island." If you're crazy, then can leave the island. All you have to do is is ask to leave. But if you ask, then you're scared for your life and that's sensible and sane. So therefore you're not crazy and you have to stay on the island. And the ones that are truly crazy never ask. So they stay on the island. Eep! Which makes Locke the one who really could leave the island, because he's the one who never asks, doesn't want to go. Oh, and it means he's crazy. ;D |
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Ah - the lights in the sky are a jumper? Parachute with emergency beacon thingee?
