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Post by Queen E on Apr 10, 2006 12:22:06 GMT -5
Only saw the episode last night with the makeup broadcast after a sports preempt so just now catching up on the thread (and review). Great job, Erin. Liked your Dirty Dancing mirror. Thought of the film myself to see L/V dancing when he says that line. But also loved the lyrics to Sway as they danced: "I don't want to hurt you." "always been a dreamer ... coming down .. my solid ground" etc. Maybe Logan and V have turned a corner. Also good catch on the St. Jude/hopeless causes as we waited for Thumper to go up with the stadium. Pixi: Logan & Spike as soulmates. Love it, love it, love it! I so wanted to put in a longer analysis of that scene between the two of them, but my head was already exploding from everything in this ep. One thing I did notice in the dance scene: No kissing, but they touched foreheads. One wonders if the key to solving the mystery is Logan and Veronica "putting their heads together," so to speak... And thanks!
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Post by Queen E on Apr 10, 2006 12:22:52 GMT -5
Great review, Erin! I loved how you tied in the real life references in the episode to their possible meanings to the show. I love those little details - especially your 'Closet Opens' section and 'who's out' and 'who's in'. We’ve got a desired destination: the Land of Who, What, When, Where, and How. Now the questions are: Who is going to ride to freedom? Who is going to go over the cliff?Still so many mysteries yet to be solved! Thanks for pulling together both some of the answers and the questions still waiting to be answered. My head is spinning! Hee! Thank you, Karen! Mine too...I have no idea where this is going; I love it!
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Post by Fotada on the fly on Apr 10, 2006 12:29:49 GMT -5
I also enjoyed you're who's in and who's out list. I do believe that while Logan may have plagiarized the phrase from Easy Rider - if you look at the scene there is more than one page on the essay Veronica looks at. Grabbing a key phrase from a book or movie to support a position and then expanding on it to the length that his essay looked - I have to argue with the plagiarizing label and Veronica could only have read a brief bit before she talked to Logan. Maybe you weren't implying that she was, but I wanted to point out that Veronica didn't actually accuse Logan of plagiarism. She quoted the line, and Logan said oh, are you quoting my essay? And she replied, no I'm quoting from Easy Rider. Basically, it's Logan admitting that the lines are the same. By quoting the line, she's calling him out on the fact that they are the same, but Logan isn't exactly defending himself. He had the opportunity to say, "Well you should read the rest before you accuse me of cheating." He didn't do that, so one can assume that he probably did plagiarize. While Veronica has been known to jump to conclusions before she has all the facts, I don't think she did anything wrong in this case.
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Post by Queen E on Apr 10, 2006 12:33:31 GMT -5
Bravo Erin - great review! A real treat to read! Yes - lots of imploding going on. Thank you so much! I wanted to (see above). There was so much there, from Gia's insistence on "being honest" to a comparison to the other dances in The Wrath of Con, Russkie Business, and Blast from the Past, the lyrics of the song they dance to, and the "putting their heads together" I mentioned above...But I was running out of brain space... Besides, you just did a lovely job of it yourself! THank you! I had fun with that... Indeed; what I thought he probably did, from what she read, is take that phrase and start his essay with it sans attribution or quotes; I didn't think he plagarized the whole thing either. And thank you!
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Post by Pixi on Apr 10, 2006 12:54:09 GMT -5
I also enjoyed you're who's in and who's out list. I do believe that while Logan may have plagiarized the phrase from Easy Rider - if you look at the scene there is more than one page on the essay Veronica looks at. Grabbing a key phrase from a book or movie to support a position and then expanding on it to the length that his essay looked - I have to argue with the plagiarizing label and Veronica could only have read a brief bit before she talked to Logan. Maybe you weren't implying that she was, but I wanted to point out that Veronica didn't actually accuse Logan of plagiarism. She quoted the line, and Logan said oh, are you quoting my essay? And she replied, no I'm quoting from Easy Rider. Basically, it's Logan admitting that the lines are the same. By quoting the line, she's calling him out on the fact that they are the same, but Logan isn't exactly defending himself. He had the opportunity to say, "Well you should read the rest before you accuse me of cheating." He didn't do that, so one can assume that he probably did plagiarize. While Veronica has been known to jump to conclusions before she has all the facts, I don't think she did anything wrong in this case. I was simply addressing Erin's review in discussing the plagerism issue - whether he did in fact plagierize. I wasn't accusing Veronica of anything.
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Post by SpringSummers on Apr 10, 2006 18:21:16 GMT -5
Only saw the episode last night with the makeup broadcast after a sports preempt so just now catching up on the thread (and review). Great job, Erin. Liked your Dirty Dancing mirror. Thought of the film myself to see L/V dancing when he says that line. But also loved the lyrics to Sway as they danced: "I don't want to hurt you." "always been a dreamer ... coming down .. my solid ground" etc. Maybe Logan and V have turned a corner. Also good catch on the St. Jude/hopeless causes as we waited for Thumper to go up with the stadium. Pixi: Logan & Spike as soulmates. Love it, love it, love it! I so wanted to put in a longer analysis of that scene between the two of them, but my head was already exploding from everything in this ep. One thing I did notice in the dance scene: No kissing, but they touched foreheads. One wonders if the key to solving the mystery is Logan and Veronica "putting their heads together," so to speak... And thanks! There's no end to what those two could accomplish by joining various body parts, is how it seems to me.
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Post by SpringSummers on Apr 10, 2006 18:43:04 GMT -5
Maybe you weren't implying that she was, but I wanted to point out that Veronica didn't actually accuse Logan of plagiarism. She quoted the line, and Logan said oh, are you quoting my essay? And she replied, no I'm quoting from Easy Rider. Basically, it's Logan admitting that the lines are the same. By quoting the line, she's calling him out on the fact that they are the same, but Logan isn't exactly defending himself. He had the opportunity to say, "Well you should read the rest before you accuse me of cheating." He didn't do that, so one can assume that he probably did plagiarize. While Veronica has been known to jump to conclusions before she has all the facts, I don't think she did anything wrong in this case. I was simply addressing Erin's review in discussing the plagerism issue - whether he did in fact plagierize. I wasn't accusing Veronica of anything. Yes - I didn't get that feeling either. I thought the whole thing was kinda played for laughs a bit - with neither party really believing any "serious cheating" type plagerism had gone on. You couldn't plagerize a whole essay on freedom from Easy Rider no matter how hard you tried. My guess is that Logan quoted a line or two without acknowledging the source - technically plagerism, yes, but - well, I've been reading a lot about this lately, due to some unhappy incidents here at the University. Seems plagerism does have degrees, and certain types can get you expelled or your degree can be revoked, and you have to re-write your thesis etc . . . other kinds require much less drastic "fixes" and consequences. You all were mentioning the Logan/Veronica dancing - I really enjoyed the way the dance started out, with Veronica pulling Logan away from Gia just as he was going to open his mouth and tell her what he really thought. The actress playing "Gia" was so funny, and Jason D as Logan . . . those two were very comical together. The dancing itself - Veronica had early in the ep had jokingly expressed some distress over not having anyone to make out with (when talking to Mac), but I thought her joking pointed to very real longing she was feeling. And there she is, dancing with a guy she's still very attracted to, and he's also at loose ends and basically in the same lonely state she's in . . . both still have feelings for the other . . . the whole feeling of attraction and longing really came through. I will be surprised if they manage to get through to the end of the season without more contact. Except Aaron is up to something. Who knows what monkey wrenches he will throw into all aspects of Logan's life?
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Post by Lola m on Apr 10, 2006 20:59:30 GMT -5
Beaverland, heh heh. Ahem. I mean, yes. Beaver was very worrying to me in this ep. Granted, it could all just be a guy not ready for sex yet, and feeling (because our society says that a guy should always want it) kind of embarassed or pressured, etc. But his reactions just seemed to hint at "something else is going on". Well, Veronica has told us that penises are very distracting, and in this Dick-less episode we get to look at Beaver. The possibilities for amusement in these two names are just endless, aren't they? #chuckle# #chuckle# #chuckle# Very true. **nods** The writers keeping us on our toes, looking for clues everywhere? I would not be surprised.
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Post by Lola m on Apr 10, 2006 21:07:11 GMT -5
Wow, Erin! Just wow! Easy rider and motorcycle gangs; Thumper’s bike – Felix’s bike – Weevil’s bike; trucks and truckers; buses; driving and movement; mechanics and explosives. You found a/the theme. The theme of the ep – theme of the mysteries! Everyone had a plan and several of those plans went boom like Thumper. Did the person who planned the bus explosion do so as part of a plan that has yet to come true or was it clean up for a plan that went sour? So many questions, and yes, I think it could be either of those. My theory is the latter; it was "clean up." However, I think that's what we've been pushed to think, what with Curly's connection to Aaron Echolls... Thank you! And yes...it reminds me of the TS Eliot poem..."This is the way the world ends/this is the way the world ends/this is the way the world ends/not with a bang but a whimper." Although the implosion was loud; it's a "turning in" and "turning on itself" that I think we're seeing here. Neptune is rotten at its core, much like Twin Peaks; and, if I may say so, this was the Twin Peakiest episode we've had... Twin Peakiest - heee! I like it. I also like the idea of "rotten to the core" Nepture just collapsing in on itself. **nods** Like Wallace's actions in being honest with his girlfriend instead of stringing things along and instead of letting her blame Jackie. Conspiracy. I'm convinced we're gonna see some version of a conspiracy/multiple "guilty" parties.
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Post by Lola m on Apr 10, 2006 21:09:58 GMT -5
Only saw the episode last night with the makeup broadcast after a sports preempt so just now catching up on the thread (and review). Great job, Erin. Liked your Dirty Dancing mirror. Thought of the film myself to see L/V dancing when he says that line. But also loved the lyrics to Sway as they danced: "I don't want to hurt you." "always been a dreamer ... coming down .. my solid ground" etc. Maybe Logan and V have turned a corner. Also good catch on the St. Jude/hopeless causes as we waited for Thumper to go up with the stadium. Pixi: Logan & Spike as soulmates. Love it, love it, love it! I so wanted to put in a longer analysis of that scene between the two of them, but my head was already exploding from everything in this ep. One thing I did notice in the dance scene: No kissing, but they touched foreheads. One wonders if the key to solving the mystery is Logan and Veronica "putting their heads together," so to speak... And thanks! I like that analogy. Logan and Veronica putting their heads together . . .
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Post by Lola m on Apr 10, 2006 21:13:18 GMT -5
I was simply addressing Erin's review in discussing the plagerism issue - whether he did in fact plagierize. I wasn't accusing Veronica of anything. Yes - I didn't get that feeling either. I thought the whole thing was kinda played for laughs a bit - with neither party really believing any "serious cheating" type plagerism had gone on. You couldn't plagerize a whole essay on freedom from Easy Rider no matter how hard you tried. My guess is that Logan quoted a line or two without acknowledging the source - technically plagerism, yes, but - well, I've been reading a lot about this lately, due to some unhappy incidents here at the University. Seems plagerism does have degrees, and certain types can get you expelled or your degree can be revoked, and you have to re-write your thesis etc . . . other kinds require much less drastic "fixes" and consequences. You all were mentioning the Logan/Veronica dancing - I really enjoyed the way the dance started out, with Veronica pulling Logan away from Gia just as he was going to open his mouth and tell her what he really thought. The actress playing "Gia" was so funny, and Jason D as Logan . . . those two were very comical together. The dancing itself - Veronica had early in the ep had jokingly expressed some distress over not having anyone to make out with (when talking to Mac), but I thought her joking pointed to very real longing she was feeling. And there she is, dancing with a guy she's still very attracted to, and he's also at loose ends and basically in the same lonely state she's in . . . both still have feelings for the other . . . the whole feeling of attraction and longing really came through. I will be surprised if they manage to get through to the end of the season without more contact. Except Aaron is up to something. Who knows what monkey wrenches he will throw into all aspects of Logan's life? **nods** Loved how they set the scene for the dance itself, amusing and snarky and light and then the akward dance itself - full of all they're not saying to each other. Lovely, really.
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Apr 11, 2006 18:42:00 GMT -5
Logan won the prize on the freedom essay, but plagarized Easy Rider. OK. Mac and Beaver have been dating for four months. Logan can be a real jackass Same scum, different wardrobe. Weevil! Logan took Lambs parking space, Hee!! The girl you're trying to make me right now is the girl I'm trying not to be. Oh, Wallace. Good music Hey, this episode is better when I'm not so sick and zoned out. Very funny, fast-moving episode. Veronica's curiousity getting the better of her. Hee. Woody is way too excited in this episode, about Logan interning, working out, talking to Keith. Beaver is really scared of Dick... and what he might do to his relationship with Mac? Gia boring Logan, Logan dropping hints that she just doesn't get. Thumper had it coming when he got involved with the Fitzpatricks. Weevil was just a catalyst. Lamb's "I could do less" sign of him being pressured by someone, Woody? Woody lying about the gardner being the stalker. Doesn't want Kieth looking into the affair. Major concern about the pagreantry of blowing up the stadium (can't stay the cameras for 20-30 min to retrieve the very expensive bike?)... indication of other things.
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Post by Lola m on Apr 11, 2006 21:01:43 GMT -5
Logan won the prize on the freedom essay, but plagarized Easy Rider. OK. Mac and Beaver have been dating for four months. Logan can be a real jackass Same scum, different wardrobe. Weevil! Logan took Lambs parking space, Hee!! The girl you're trying to make me right now is the girl I'm trying not to be. Oh, Wallace. Good music Hey, this episode is better when I'm not so sick and zoned out. Very funny, fast-moving episode. **nods** With lots more stuff in it than you realise at first. Yes. But a catalyst fully aware of what he is, um, catalyzing. I mean, I think he knew, at least in general, what was going to happen to Thumper - it's what Weevil wanted to happen. And so it's why he's talking to the priest at the end. Oooh, I hadn't looked at it that way. Intriguing! Good thoughts!!
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Post by Sue on Apr 16, 2006 18:37:29 GMT -5
Erin, my sweet! Great, great job. Thanks so much for filling in for me! Superb job!
I liked your intro:
Great imagery using the truck metaphor and the possible futures of all of our characters and their plans (and later, their Plan Bs as well.)
And, I loved all of the images of time passing or being counted off. Very, very perceptive.
I thought this was a brilliant catch. It never even remotely occurred to me, but I think you are definitely onto something:
Yes, the theme of "outing" has been repeated many, many times this season. Of course, everyone has secrets they don't want brought out into the open, so it's hard to know if these references refer specifically to the homosexual allusions or to the outing of any secret, in general. But this is a very good list:
Yes, that is a very interesting scene. Do we have any idea who the children were or what their connection to either Weevil or Thumper was? (if any?). We've also had Weevil's niece Olivia---and he involved her directly in a serious crime. (Altho she may have had no idea what was in the box.) And a whole episode about Neptune's children in Nobody Puts Baby in a Corner (interestingly, the other ep referencing Dirty Dancing---which was ALL about class differences) culminating in the revelation of the abuse of Grace Manning---which is another crime which has not been punished.
And there is even Duncan's infant. Hmmmm, what's up with all of these children? Finally, I really liked how you noted all of the instances of taping/recording----starting all the way back in last season's finale.
Great summation:
Thanks again. I knew I'd left the episode in capable hands.
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Post by Queen E on Apr 18, 2006 12:23:34 GMT -5
Erin, my sweet! Great, great job. Thanks so much for filling in for me! Superb job! I liked your intro: Thank you! I really feel like all this focus on "transportation" is no accident: busses, trucks, bikes, etc. I mean, we had Jane's sister on a tour bus, the car that stops Curly's beatdown, Felix's and Molly's dream of long-haul trucking. All this focus on moving forward... And thank you again. There's definitely a "getting busy living or get busy dying" vibe. What happens when your plans fall apart? When the unexpected occurs. Naming the episode after emergency contraception is no accident, I think. Well, we are reaching the end of the line for these characters in terms of this phase. They are all counting down to life after high school, and even if you don't go to college, that's a huge life change: socially, financially, legally. It's the beginning (one would hope) of being responsible for your own plans...and it keeps ticking away. There are so many references to time throughout the season; Woody's reminiscing about being young dovetails with "My Mother, the Fiend," where we see that Lianne's life in many ways peaked in high school. Blame "Angel." Writing about all those episodes sensitized me to repeated words. (I really hope that will help with grad school. ) In some ways, I might be a smidge disappointed if the outing was meant in the conventional sense of the word. And in a tiny town like Neptune, one wonders if any secret is ever really kept for long: an "open secret" if you will. Weevil's attack on Thumper is definitely one of those. I think that, even more than last season, we see that the children of Neptune are always paying for the "sins of the fathers." How many times have we seen the "True Hollywood Story" thing on the Echolls family? As screwed up as some of Logan's behavior has been, it's his father's that makes him notorious. And where on earth are Weevil's parents? He lives with his grandmother and takes care of his sister Ophelia. Why did he involve her in the Magic Mountain theft? My thought is that he is trying to teach her that it's "kill or be killed," one lesson at a time. Which is really harsh for a child, but I can see the motivation. I could see it even more clearly if I had any idea what happened to Mr and Mrs Navarro... I wish I could figure out who the children were, too. I played the scene frame by frame three times, to see if it was maybe Ophelia, but I could not really make out the face. Hee! Now I'm flashing on Vinnie Van Lowe smacking his ass and singing "Private eyes are watching you..." Seriously, though, I think this HAS to be significant, or there would not have been such a focus on it throughout the season. Which brings us back to Aaron Echolls and the erased tapes. My head is spinning. Thank you for letting me write it! I had a lot of fun...and hope I was able to live up to you and Spring's skills!
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