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Post by Michelle on May 30, 2006 15:24:33 GMT -5
S’cubies! Hey, people, look alive!! The Veronica Mars review finale is now available. Go to www.soulfulspike.com and read :[/size] NOT PICTURED: The Facts of Life – by Spring Summers You can also access it directly by clicking on the image of a still very-much-alive Carol Channing, below:[/quote] Hee!! I haven't read your review yet, but I love, love, LOVE that you used the pic of Carol Channing! Too funny. The look on Veronica's face when Keith asks if CC is still alive is priceless. Now, I'm running off to read your review!
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Post by LadyDi on May 30, 2006 16:01:45 GMT -5
Love the review, Spring!! I especially enjoyed this part: Wonderful observation--I'm kicking myself for not catching it. Job well done! Thanks, Monnie. Yes - I loved all the Logan/Lover/Adulthood vs Keith/Daddy/childhood imagery also - --Right after Veronica's dad "dies," who shows up to be at her side? Logan. Logan, for whom her feelings are not "daughterly" but "womanly." --Who is there, answering to the cry "Dad!" when she wakes up? Who is actually "bringing home the bacon?" Logan. Again, someone the "woman" not the "little girl" in Veronica turns to in time of need. --She runs straight from Logan to Dad's arms . . . but then we see the next morning, she plans to ride with Logan, not Dad, to the airport. She's a girl in transition to womanhood, something that's being partly represented by her becoming a fully sexual human being, with Logan in the figurative "husband/equal partner" rather than "parent/child" role. Very nice observations here, Spring. I have to say, tho', it's a much more objective/less agenda-driven take on the situation than Joss presented in BtVS, and I'm grateful for it. I found this quote in The Beauty Myth by Naomi Wolf, and it made me think of s6 of Buffy: When female sexual activity lost its useful penalties, the [beauty] Rites replaced the fear, guilt, and shame that women had been taught must always follow pleasure (emphasis mine). In both of her "Great Romances" sex is literally demonized, and Buffy is left feeling guilty and ashamed. Not necessarily for the sex, but for who she's doing it with. Even so, it suggests that romance is dangerous, and women who enjoy sex will, perhaps even should, suffer for it. But maybe the girl needs some monster in her man because there's some monster in the girl.
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Post by Michelle on May 30, 2006 18:10:05 GMT -5
S’cubies! Hey, people, look alive!! The Veronica Mars review finale is now available. Go to www.soulfulspike.com and read :[/size] NOT PICTURED: The Facts of Life – by Spring Summers You can also access it directly by clicking on the image of a still very-much-alive Carol Channing, below:[/quote] Hee!! I haven't read your review yet, but I love, love, LOVE that you used the pic of Carol Channing! Too funny. The look on Veronica's face when Keith asks if CC is still alive is priceless. Now, I'm running off to read your review![/quote] OK, I've read it now. Whoo hoo!! But first I must say that, as Karen and others have said, I have a HUGE appreciation for what you and Sue do! (Not to mention our guest reviewers this season!) It's such a treat to read a thoughtful analysis of each episode. Almost every time I read them, I do a mental smack upside my head and say, "Duh! Now why didn't I think of that?" Reading this brought on a mental smack: Yes! She's standing there waiting for her dad, and there's no way to get a message in or out. She must make a decision, all on her own, whether to fly off into the wild blue yonder, or stay grounded and return to home base. HAAAAA!!! OK, that made me snort in a very unlady-like manner! Too right. That is perfect. Well, almost--the feminist in me chafes a little at the idea that Veronica needs a man in her life. But yes, I can definitely see your point about Veronica working this out in both her dreams and in reality. You're probably right about that, but I actually hope that it's something besides money. Here's why: 1) I don't think of Kendall as a giver, particularly when it comes to money. If Kendall wants something, she offers her body, not her dead presidents. 2) I think Keith has higher standards than to let Veronica down for the sake of maybe, possibly coming into a suitcase of money. In my mind, only something truly mind-blowing would cause him to ditch his daughter. I'm thinking it's some majorly incriminating evidence of some sort, something that as a former sheriff, he simply can NOT ignore. Have you seen the video of Kristin Veitch (of Watch Wanda fame) interviewing Enrico Colantoni at the CW upfronts? She asked him what was in the briefcase and he said it was...cookies! Hilarious!
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Post by SpringSummers on May 30, 2006 18:13:20 GMT -5
Thanks, Monnie. Yes - I loved all the Logan/Lover/Adulthood vs Keith/Daddy/childhood imagery also - --Right after Veronica's dad "dies," who shows up to be at her side? Logan. Logan, for whom her feelings are not "daughterly" but "womanly." --Who is there, answering to the cry "Dad!" when she wakes up? Who is actually "bringing home the bacon?" Logan. Again, someone the "woman" not the "little girl" in Veronica turns to in time of need. --She runs straight from Logan to Dad's arms . . . but then we see the next morning, she plans to ride with Logan, not Dad, to the airport. She's a girl in transition to womanhood, something that's being partly represented by her becoming a fully sexual human being, with Logan in the figurative "husband/equal partner" rather than "parent/child" role. Very nice observations here, Spring. I have to say, tho', it's a much more objective/less agenda-driven take on the situation than Joss presented in BtVS, and I'm grateful for it. I found this quote in The Beauty Myth by Naomi Wolf, and it made me think of s6 of Buffy: When female sexual activity lost its useful penalties, the [beauty] Rites replaced the fear, guilt, and shame that women had been taught must always follow pleasure (emphasis mine). In both of her "Great Romances" sex is literally demonized, and Buffy is left feeling guilty and ashamed. Not necessarily for the sex, but for who she's doing it with. Even so, it suggests that romance is dangerous, and women who enjoy sex will, perhaps even should, suffer for it. But maybe the girl needs some monster in her man because there's some monster in the girl. Thanks for the feedback, Di. The whole Logan-Veronica-Keith scenario is somewhat reminiscent of the Spike-Buffy-Giles thing . . . that comes to a head in Lies My Parents Told Me . . . of course, the whole Vampire/Slayer/Watcher thing (as opposed to RegularGuy/Regular Girl/Girl's Dad) did give it a much different, more operatic shall we say, flavor. But the idea is the same . . . a girl eventually breaks from her father, and becomes a woman (which partly involves accepting her sexuality - which for Buffy was represented by Spike, and I think, for Veronica, will be represented by Logan.) Can't wait for next season of VM. I wonder if Veronica & Logan will actually consumate the relationship in Season 3, or if something will interfere before they can get that far?
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on May 30, 2006 19:34:45 GMT -5
S’cubies! Hey, people, look alive!! The Veronica Mars review finale is now available. Go to www.soulfulspike.com and read :[/size] NOT PICTURED: The Facts of Life – by Spring Summers You can also access it directly by clicking on the image of a still very-much-alive Carol Channing, below:I hope you like the review – if so, give me your feedback over on the VM ep 2.22 thread. First, smile and say cheese . . . . . .then click on the pic above to enter the thread. If you don’t like the review, well – however wrong it turned out, it’s done. We’re people with lives and we will not obsess; we’ll move on. I’ll get my justice in my own way. (I’m thinking free gelato.) [/quote] #claps# Lovely review, Spring. BWAH!!!!
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Post by SpringSummers on May 31, 2006 7:26:13 GMT -5
Hee!! I haven't read your review yet, but I love, love, LOVE that you used the pic of Carol Channing! Too funny. The look on Veronica's face when Keith asks if CC is still alive is priceless. Now, I'm running off to read your review! OK, I've read it now. Whoo hoo!! But first I must say that, as Karen and others have said, I have a HUGE appreciation for what you and Sue do! (Not to mention our guest reviewers this season!) It's such a treat to read a thoughtful analysis of each episode. Almost every time I read them, I do a mental smack upside my head and say, "Duh! Now why didn't I think of that?" Reading this brought on a mental smack: Yes! She's standing there waiting for her dad, and there's no way to get a message in or out. She must make a decision, all on her own, whether to fly off into the wild blue yonder, or stay grounded and return to home base. Thanks for great feedback and encouragement. You were unladylike while reading my review? This surprises me as I go for "lady-like" in all that I write, at all times. I don't think the message is meant to be "Veronica needs a man in her life" so much as "Veronica's needs are shifting from a child's needs, to an adult's needs." And her coming into her womanhood is being, in part, represented by her coming into her sexuality. And Logan is the rep on that, I think. True, but I think Kendall would know better than to offer Keith her body. I agree. My completely wild-guess thought is this: There's money in the briefcase, enough to tempt Keith to pause and take some time with Kendall after all. But something happens from there . . . something significant enough for Keith to decide to leave Veronica waiting, or something that forces Keith to do so, even though he doesn't want to. In other words, my theory is that, tempted by the money, he takes some kind of preliminary action with Kendall . . . something he expects to take a few minutes, but ends up holding him up. That does sound cute. I have not seen it though.
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Post by SpringSummers on May 31, 2006 7:33:04 GMT -5
S’cubies! Hey, people, look alive!! The Veronica Mars review finale is now available. Go to www.soulfulspike.com and read :[/size] NOT PICTURED: The Facts of Life – by Spring Summers You can also access it directly by clicking on the image of a still very-much-alive Carol Channing, below:[/quote] Lovely review, Spring. BWAH!!!![/quote] Glad you enjoyed, Liz - and as always, thanks for the feedback. I see my "thinking of England" line is getting some reaction. I almost left it out, worried about offending delicate S'cubie sensibilities. The advice from Veronica to Mac, about England, fit right into all the "fantasy" images and dialogue . . . fantasy camp, Norman Rockwell, the fantasy Woody had built with himself as a savior of sorts, Veronica's dreams, etc. That was a cute scene between Veronica & Mac, and it did a great job setting up the contrast between Mac's sweet, innocent excitement and expectations, and the way things really turned out.
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Post by Michelle on May 31, 2006 9:31:17 GMT -5
Have you seen the video of Kristin Veitch (of Watch Wanda fame) interviewing Enrico Colantoni at the CW upfronts? She asked him what was in the briefcase and he said it was...cookies! Hilarious! That does sound cute. I have not seen it though. If you want to check it out, go to www.eonline.com/ then click on "The Vine." A pop up window will open, and if you type "Veronica Mars" in the search field, the very first result is the video clip I'm talking about. She interviews both Enrico and Jason Dohring. (She's obviously a big fan of Jason).
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on May 31, 2006 21:09:16 GMT -5
Hee!! I haven't read your review yet, but I love, love, LOVE that you used the pic of Carol Channing! Too funny. The look on Veronica's face when Keith asks if CC is still alive is priceless. Now, I'm running off to read your review! OK, I've read it now. Whoo hoo!! But first I must say that, as Karen and others have said, I have a HUGE appreciation for what you and Sue do! (Not to mention our guest reviewers this season!) It's such a treat to read a thoughtful analysis of each episode. Almost every time I read them, I do a mental smack upside my head and say, "Duh! Now why didn't I think of that?" Reading this brought on a mental smack: Yes! She's standing there waiting for her dad, and there's no way to get a message in or out. She must make a decision, all on her own, whether to fly off into the wild blue yonder, or stay grounded and return to home base. HAAAAA!!! OK, that made me snort in a very unlady-like manner! Too right. That is perfect. Well, almost--the feminist in me chafes a little at the idea that Veronica needs a man in her life. But yes, I can definitely see your point about Veronica working this out in both her dreams and in reality. You're probably right about that, but I actually hope that it's something besides money. Here's why: 1) I don't think of Kendall as a giver, particularly when it comes to money. If Kendall wants something, she offers her body, not her dead presidents. 2) I think Keith has higher standards than to let Veronica down for the sake of maybe, possibly coming into a suitcase of money. In my mind, only something truly mind-blowing would cause him to ditch his daughter. I'm thinking it's some majorly incriminating evidence of some sort, something that as a former sheriff, he simply can NOT ignore. Have you seen the video of Kristin Veitch (of Watch Wanda fame) interviewing Enrico Colantoni at the CW upfronts? She asked him what was in the briefcase and he said it was...cookies! Hilarious! Maybe it's not so much about needing a man in her life as much as how she relates to the important men in her life. Relating to a Lover/Husband figure as an equal as opposed to a father figure. In fact, as strong as Veronica and Keith's relationship is, there's been quite a strain on it as Veronica is growing up and doing things she thinks she needs to do that Keith does not approve of to varying degrees. Also, I keep forgetting to mention this, but the "smells like bacon" line from the dream sequences makes me think of how it's said that burning flesh smells like bacon. Probably intended to be home and family feeling rather than morbid, though, but I guess my mind works in strange ways.
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Post by leftylady on Jun 1, 2006 19:03:18 GMT -5
OK, I've read it now. Whoo hoo!! But first I must say that, as Karen and others have said, I have a HUGE appreciation for what you and Sue do! (Not to mention our guest reviewers this season!) It's such a treat to read a thoughtful analysis of each episode. Almost every time I read them, I do a mental smack upside my head and say, "Duh! Now why didn't I think of that?" Reading this brought on a mental smack: Yes! She's standing there waiting for her dad, and there's no way to get a message in or out. She must make a decision, all on her own, whether to fly off into the wild blue yonder, or stay grounded and return to home base. HAAAAA!!! OK, that made me snort in a very unlady-like manner! Too right. That is perfect. Well, almost--the feminist in me chafes a little at the idea that Veronica needs a man in her life. But yes, I can definitely see your point about Veronica working this out in both her dreams and in reality. You're probably right about that, but I actually hope that it's something besides money. Here's why: 1) I don't think of Kendall as a giver, particularly when it comes to money. If Kendall wants something, she offers her body, not her dead presidents. 2) I think Keith has higher standards than to let Veronica down for the sake of maybe, possibly coming into a suitcase of money. In my mind, only something truly mind-blowing would cause him to ditch his daughter. I'm thinking it's some majorly incriminating evidence of some sort, something that as a former sheriff, he simply can NOT ignore. Have you seen the video of Kristin Veitch (of Watch Wanda fame) interviewing Enrico Colantoni at the CW upfronts? She asked him what was in the briefcase and he said it was...cookies! Hilarious! Maybe it's not so much about needing a man in her life as much as how she relates to the important men in her life. Relating to a Lover/Husband figure as an equal as opposed to a father figure. In fact, as strong as Veronica and Keith's relationship is, there's been quite a strain on it as Veronica is growing up and doing things she thinks she needs to do that Keith does not approve of to varying degrees. Also, I keep forgetting to mention this, but the "smells like bacon" line from the dream sequences makes me think of how it's said that burning flesh smells like bacon. Probably intended to be home and family feeling rather than morbid, though, but I guess my mind works in strange ways. Personally, I related the dream ending bacon to "waking up and smelling the coffee" so to speak - just back to the real world. Great review, Spring. I know we will all be "thinking of England" if RT doesn't get his full 22 next season!!! Oh, and about the dream dress/"Restless" dress, I posted a while back a comparison of the two dresses. They are remarkably similar. I wonder if it was a shout out?
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Post by Michelle on Jun 2, 2006 10:23:12 GMT -5
That is perfect. Well, almost--the feminist in me chafes a little at the idea that Veronica needs a man in her life. But yes, I can definitely see your point about Veronica working this out in both her dreams and in reality. Maybe it's not so much about needing a man in her life as much as how she relates to the important men in her life. Relating to a Lover/Husband figure as an equal as opposed to a father figure. In fact, as strong as Veronica and Keith's relationship is, there's been quite a strain on it as Veronica is growing up and doing things she thinks she needs to do that Keith does not approve of to varying degrees. Yes, I can see that. In the past, it has been made apparent that Veronica craves stability, whether from her father or her boyfriend. She repeatedly has said that the one who cares is the one who stays. She really respects her father for sticking around after being ousted as sheriff when her mother couldn't hack it. And she broke up with Logan when he was going off the rails last summer, then returned to her seemingly stable first love, Duncan. By the end of the season, Veronica is once again testing the waters with Logan, Mr. Not-So-Stable Guy. And college life is probably going to threaten Veronica's sense of stability even more. I'm expecting a lot of changes in Veronica's life next season! Yikes. Is that true? I love the smell of bacon, but now that I've read that...not so much. Someone mentioned that the bacon thing might be a shout out to a scene from Lost, but I don't watch that show, so I can't verify this.
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Post by SpringSummers on Jun 2, 2006 12:18:49 GMT -5
Maybe it's not so much about needing a man in her life as much as how she relates to the important men in her life. Relating to a Lover/Husband figure as an equal as opposed to a father figure. In fact, as strong as Veronica and Keith's relationship is, there's been quite a strain on it as Veronica is growing up and doing things she thinks she needs to do that Keith does not approve of to varying degrees. Also, I keep forgetting to mention this, but the "smells like bacon" line from the dream sequences makes me think of how it's said that burning flesh smells like bacon. Probably intended to be home and family feeling rather than morbid, though, but I guess my mind works in strange ways. Personally, I related the dream ending bacon to "waking up and smelling the coffee" so to speak - just back to the real world. Great review, Spring. I know we will all be "thinking of England" if RT doesn't get his full 22 next season!!! Oh, and about the dream dress/"Restless" dress, I posted a while back a comparison of the two dresses. They are remarkably similar. I wonder if it was a shout out? Thanks for the feedback, leftyloo. I didn't realize that the dress in this dream was one V had in a previous dream . . . but now that you say that, it sounds familiar. As far as if it was a shout out - I dunno. But: "Say Cheese!!"
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Post by LadyDi on Jun 3, 2006 0:57:03 GMT -5
I second the "wake up and smell the coffee" interpretation of the whole bacon thing. I don't think the idea was that V. needs a man in her life either. But she, like all of us, needs connections. I'm just really grateful she got to reconnect with Logan. Here's a young woman who can turn to someone (a guy, even!) for comfort and emotional support in a time of severe emotional crisis without being seen or seeing herself as weak a/o selfish. How great is that? I've obsessed, ok? At length. At least I'm man enough to admit it.
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Post by leftylady on Jun 3, 2006 11:50:04 GMT -5
I second the "wake up and smell the coffee" interpretation of the whole bacon thing. I don't think the idea was that V. needs a man in her life either. But she, like all of us, needs connections. I'm just really grateful she got to reconnect with Logan. Here's a young woman who can turn to someone (a guy, even!) for comfort and emotional support in a time of severe emotional crisis without being seen or seeing herself as weak a/o selfish. How great is that? I've obsessed, ok? At length. At least I'm man enough to admit it. In this Starbucks world, nobody is going to "wake up and smell the latte", so "bacon" seemed a natural (and aromatic) substitution for the "smell the coffee". And I agree, turning to Logan seemed natural and in no way weak or selfish as was Logan's dropping his season-long snark vis a vis V.
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Post by leftylady on Jun 3, 2006 12:01:24 GMT -5
Personally, I related the dream ending bacon to "waking up and smelling the coffee" so to speak - just back to the real world. Great review, Spring. I know we will all be "thinking of England" if RT doesn't get his full 22 next season!!! Oh, and about the dream dress/"Restless" dress, I posted a while back a comparison of the two dresses. They are remarkably similar. I wonder if it was a shout out? Thanks for the feedback, leftyloo. I didn't realize that the dress in this dream was one V had in a previous dream . . . but now that you say that, it sounds familiar. As far as if it was a shout out - I dunno. But: "Say Cheese!!" Hi, Spring. Ooh, "leftyloo" - I got a new nickname! What I meant about the dresses: Several posted mentioned the "girly-ness" of the V dream dress and the "girly-ness" of Buffy's dress in her "Restless" dream. Viewing the "Not Pictured" tape and "Restless" almost back to back, I noticed marked similarities - in color (light blue-ish on my tv), in print (floral print, both with a prominent red flower) and style (sun dress with a decorative panel at the hem line). Maybe someone can compare with photos. Ok, we'll say "Cheese", but in Veronica's case, "the cheese" doesn't "stand alone" as long as she has Keith and now Logan.
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