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Post by Karen on Feb 3, 2006 23:23:06 GMT -5
I'll share what I said to Onjel when she made the same point: Cat publically challenged her commanding officer at every opportunity, constantly undermined her ability to lead, and all-but sucker punched her. And for that, she became top gun and got to humiliate Kara in front of all her colleagues--neglecting to mention that Kara essentially set Scar up on a [profanity deleted] tee for her. So while I agree that Kara outclassed her at every turn, particularly at the end, Cat still came out far too much ahead for my liking. ETA: But, as you noticed, my feelings are a bit strong in this regard. So I might not be all that unbiased an observer.  I just hate seeing people getting away with crappy behavior. As I said to Sara, it's the injustice of it all that is so frustrating and enraging. Cat acted like a shit, and broke every military protocol in dealing with her CO that I can think of, and yet, she gets to be "top gun", blah, blah, blah. That is what gets to one on a visceral level. But, still, Kara totally outclassed her and showed great maturity and leadership skill in doing so. I didn't like it either. Kat was really pushing the line with her sarcastic 'Captain' sass. But there was a element of truth to what she said to Starbuck - about her drinking. Maybe her insubordination was just was Starbuck needed to snap her out of wallowing in self-pity. And to Kat's credit, she did come to Starbuck's aid - even if she did it for the glory more than to save Starbuck. I can see where they might become friends, because female friends are in short supply in that 'verse, and I think they are important. |
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Post by Lola m on Feb 3, 2006 23:23:07 GMT -5
So, Sara. Tell us how you really feel.  Yes, she was seriously pissing me off, too. But Starbuck has class, and she stole Kat's thunder there at the end. I'll share what I said to Onjel when she made the same point: Cat publically challenged her commanding officer at every opportunity, constantly undermined her ability to lead, and all-but sucker punched her. And for that, she became top gun and got to humiliate Kara in front of all her colleagues--neglecting to mention that Kara essentially set Scar up on a [profanity deleted] tee for her. So while I agree that Kara outclassed her at every turn, particularly at the end, Cat still came out far too much ahead for my liking. ETA: But, as you noticed, my feelings are a bit strong in this regard. So I might not be all that unbiased an observer. I just hate seeing people getting away with crappy behavior. **nods to all of this, enthusiastically** But, Cat doesn't really have what she thinks she does. There's nothing real inside to keep her going, so she's gonna collapse like a house of cards someday. |
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Post by Karen on Feb 3, 2006 23:27:53 GMT -5
"You ever think about him."  Don't run or you'll die. Hmmmm. The way Lee just nodded his head, knowing the guy would die. So, you can't run or you die. And you can't turn and fight or you die. Drunken Starbuck and Apollo. "That we will never see." "Bright shiny future's overrated anyway." Well. Aren't they the matched pair. "Why don't we what?"  ;D Oh, Lee you are just dumber than a stump sometimes.
Wow! And then we get honesty!! I'm hung up on a dead guy. And I'm messed up and don't know what to do. #rofl1# Lee really did have that deer caught in the headlights look to him, didn't he? *whew* Got a little steamy there for a bit, before Lee spoiled it by wanting Kara to slow down. Damn!  |
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Post by Onjel on Feb 3, 2006 23:29:41 GMT -5
"You ever think about him." Don't run or you'll die. Hmmmm. The way Lee just nodded his head, knowing the guy would die. So, you can't run or you die. And you can't turn and fight or you die. Drunken Starbuck and Apollo. "That we will never see." "Bright shiny future's overrated anyway." Well. Aren't they the matched pair. "Why don't we what?" ;D Oh, Lee you are just dumber than a stump sometimes.
Wow! And then we get honesty!! I'm hung up on a dead guy. And I'm messed up and don't know what to do.  Lee really did have that deer caught in the headlights look to him, didn't he? *whew* Got a little steamy there for a bit, before Lee spoiled it by wanting Kara to slow down. Damn! It had such promise. *sigh* |
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Post by Karen on Feb 3, 2006 23:31:29 GMT -5
OMG! Get out! Damn. Frackus interruptus due to projecting. It had promise too. Ok. That was a very girly thing to do, clap him across the face. Sometimes I like seeing Starbuck girly. But I like her strong, better, I think. #rofl1# I knew it was too good to be true! That ship just ain't ready to be boarded. |
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Post by Sara on Feb 3, 2006 23:33:01 GMT -5
I have never wanted to hurt a person as much as I want to hurt Cat. Except maybe T-Bag on Prison Break. I mean I seriously want to beat her head in with the Louisville. Or cut her heart out with a spork. Spork her in the eye! That'd do it. Yeah, that'd fit the bill as well. |
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Post by Onjel on Feb 3, 2006 23:36:12 GMT -5
OMG! Get out! Damn. Frackus interruptus due to projecting. It had promise too. Ok. That was a very girly thing to do, clap him across the face. Sometimes I like seeing Starbuck girly. But I like her strong, better, I think. I knew it was too good to be true! T That ship just ain't ready to be boarded. Someday, maybe. *sigh* |
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Post by Onjel on Feb 3, 2006 23:36:46 GMT -5
Nighty night, all! #bighug#
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Post by Matthew on Feb 3, 2006 23:48:19 GMT -5
As I said to Sara, it's the injustice of it all that is so frustrating and enraging. Cat acted like a shit, and broke every military protocol in dealing with her CO that I can think of, and yet, she gets to be "top gun", blah, blah, blah. That is what gets to one on a visceral level. But, still, Kara totally outclassed her and showed great maturity and leadership skill in doing so. I didn't like it either. Kat was really pushing the line with her sarcastic 'Captain' sass. But there was a element of truth to what she said to Starbuck - about her drinking. Maybe her insubordination was just was Starbuck needed to snap her out of wallowing in self-pity. And to Kat's credit, she did come to Starbuck's aid - even if she did it for the glory more than to save Starbuck. I can see where they might become friends, because female friends are in short supply in that 'verse, and I think they are important. Biggest thing is, even if she felt the need to say stuff to Starbuck, to help her, doing it in front of the whole flight group was the goddamned worst thing she could have done: questioning their confidence in her as a pilot and as a ranking officer, when they are getting ready to face one of their canniest enemies. Setting up whoever flew with her to have NO confidence in her as a wingman. I think Apollo saw that, and teamed them up intentionally. |
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Post by Lola m on Feb 4, 2006 12:26:12 GMT -5
As I said to Sara, it's the injustice of it all that is so frustrating and enraging. Cat acted like a shit, and broke every military protocol in dealing with her CO that I can think of, and yet, she gets to be "top gun", blah, blah, blah. That is what gets to one on a visceral level. But, still, Kara totally outclassed her and showed great maturity and leadership skill in doing so. I didn't like it either. Kat was really pushing the line with her sarcastic 'Captain' sass. But there was a element of truth to what she said to Starbuck - about her drinking. Maybe her insubordination was just was Starbuck needed to snap her out of wallowing in self-pity. And to Kat's credit, she did come to Starbuck's aid - even if she did it for the glory more than to save Starbuck. I can see where they might become friends, because female friends are in short supply in that 'verse, and I think they are important. And they do have some similarities, in that Starbuck has acted in a sort-of similar way to Tigh, for example. But there are some important differences, mostly in the ways in which Cat went over the line in a public way to undermine Starbuck's authority. |
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Post by Lola m on Feb 4, 2006 12:27:09 GMT -5
"You ever think about him." Don't run or you'll die. Hmmmm. The way Lee just nodded his head, knowing the guy would die. So, you can't run or you die. And you can't turn and fight or you die. Drunken Starbuck and Apollo. "That we will never see." "Bright shiny future's overrated anyway." Well. Aren't they the matched pair. "Why don't we what?" ;D Oh, Lee you are just dumber than a stump sometimes.
Wow! And then we get honesty!! I'm hung up on a dead guy. And I'm messed up and don't know what to do. Lee really did have that deer caught in the headlights look to him, didn't he? *whew* Got a little steamy there for a bit, before Lee spoiled it by wanting Kara to slow down. Damn! Yeah! Actually, I had a sort of "Faith-in-Buffy with Riley" vibe to the scene. Anyone else? |
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Post by Lola m on Feb 4, 2006 12:28:53 GMT -5
I didn't like it either. Kat was really pushing the line with her sarcastic 'Captain' sass. But there was a element of truth to what she said to Starbuck - about her drinking. Maybe her insubordination was just was Starbuck needed to snap her out of wallowing in self-pity. And to Kat's credit, she did come to Starbuck's aid - even if she did it for the glory more than to save Starbuck. I can see where they might become friends, because female friends are in short supply in that 'verse, and I think they are important. Biggest thing is, even if she felt the need to say stuff to Starbuck, to help her, doing it in front of the whole flight group was the goddamned worst thing she could have done: questioning their confidence in her as a pilot and as a ranking officer, when they are getting ready to face one of their canniest enemies. Setting up whoever flew with her to have NO confidence in her as a wingman. I think Apollo saw that, and teamed them up intentionally. Oh, yeah. Something like that is really just gonna make the group distance themselves from her. |
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Post by Karen on Feb 4, 2006 13:04:28 GMT -5
I didn't like it either. Kat was really pushing the line with her sarcastic 'Captain' sass. But there was a element of truth to what she said to Starbuck - about her drinking. Maybe her insubordination was just was Starbuck needed to snap her out of wallowing in self-pity. And to Kat's credit, she did come to Starbuck's aid - even if she did it for the glory more than to save Starbuck. I can see where they might become friends, because female friends are in short supply in that 'verse, and I think they are important. Biggest thing is, even if she felt the need to say stuff to Starbuck, to help her, doing it in front of the whole flight group was the goddamned worst thing she could have done: questioning their confidence in her as a pilot and as a ranking officer, when they are getting ready to face one of their canniest enemies. Setting up whoever flew with her to have NO confidence in her as a wingman. I think Apollo saw that, and teamed them up intentionally. You are absolutely right! It was the wrong thing to do - to try and undermine Starbuck's authority like she did. I like how Apollo had Starbuck's back. He always will, no matter what, I think. Starbuck is so the man! When she had to have words with Kat she cleared the room out with "Give us the room." Oh - there is one woman at work that I would love to use that on sometime - but I'm not her superior, so I wouldn't be able to. But it would be cool. |
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Post by Spaced Out Looney on Feb 4, 2006 21:12:50 GMT -5
Lots of stuff in this episode.
Love the editing juxtaposition this week. Worked much better than last week. The show is back, yay!
Scar as the white whale.
Kat's interesting, I didn't really remember her before. But no call sign for her? Just Kat?
Kat as Starbuck's foil?
Interesting Boomer/Starbuck conversation. Immortality vs humanity. Raiders as sentient. Humans weren't thinking that way. And neither were we.
Kara and Lee. Yummy! But ended too soon.
"Fine with the dead guys, it's the living ones you can't deal with"
Parallels between Starbuck here and Apollo in Resurrection Ship.
A lot of people in lj-land didn't like the episode's non-linear structure. Did that bother anyone here? To tell you the truth, it really didn't bother me because I don't tend to think linearly.
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Post by Karen on Feb 4, 2006 22:28:56 GMT -5
I didn't like it either. Kat was really pushing the line with her sarcastic 'Captain' sass. But there was a element of truth to what she said to Starbuck - about her drinking. Maybe her insubordination was just was Starbuck needed to snap her out of wallowing in self-pity. And to Kat's credit, she did come to Starbuck's aid - even if she did it for the glory more than to save Starbuck. I can see where they might become friends, because female friends are in short supply in that 'verse, and I think they are important. And they do have some similarities, in that Starbuck has acted in a sort-of similar way to Tigh, for example. But there are some important differences, mostly in the ways in which Cat went over the line in a public way to undermine Starbuck's authority. My memory is kind of spotty, but didn't Starbuck rag on Tigh's drinking in public and even go so far as to hit him? I think near the end, Starbuck saw a lot of herself in Kat, and it pulled her up short. |
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I just hate seeing people getting away with crappy behavior. 
