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Post by William the Bloody on Dec 22, 2003 16:35:04 GMT -5
Let the discussion begin.
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Post by thelittlestvampire on Dec 22, 2003 19:17:23 GMT -5
Great review Spring! I wish I had something deep to add- but you covered it all!
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Post by SpringSummers on Dec 23, 2003 7:14:57 GMT -5
Great review Spring! I wish I had something deep to add- but you covered it all! Thank you, TLV. It is good to know simply that people are reading and enjoying. Happy Holidays!!
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Post by Karen on Dec 23, 2003 11:36:10 GMT -5
I really enjoyed your Restless review. It's the first analysis of it I have read. When I watch the episode again, it'll be with fresh eyes - spring fresh. I like your references to aloneness and how our dreams visit our fears. It was interesting to me how even though everyone is separate from each other while dreaming, they each seemed to be connected - subconsciously - with each other. Like you said, "despite the solitary nature of the dreams and all the desolate images, the dreams are actually connected: By the Cheese Man, The First Slayer and by Xander's sucking chest wound..." This seems to be saying that we really are all connected, on another level. That we are part of a whole, whether or not we realize it or or accept it. A good feeling. Dreaming releases our fears into a safe realm of other-reality - our subconscious. If we didn't dream, our reality might be our dreams, or our fears. Stress or lack of sleep hinders our dreams. Dreaming is very important to our psyches (sp?). Just wanted to say how much I enjoyed your analysis. You're right when you say that you could look at every line and image and expand on it. Oh, and The Cheese Man. Joss may say he meant nothing. But I always thought of the aloneness of dreams, Buffy and the nursery rhyme with the last line - 'the cheese stands alone'. Thank you!!!
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Post by SpringSummers on Dec 23, 2003 13:14:25 GMT -5
I really enjoyed your Restless review. It's the first analysis of it I have read. When I watch the episode again, it'll be with fresh eyes - spring fresh. I like your references to aloneness and how our dreams visit our fears. It was interesting to me how even though everyone is separate from each other while dreaming, they each seemed to be connected - subconsciously - with each other. Like you said, "despite the solitary nature of the dreams and all the desolate images, the dreams are actually connected: By the Cheese Man, The First Slayer and by Xander's sucking chest wound..." This seems to be saying that we really are all connected, on another level. That we are part of a whole, whether or not we realize it or or accept it. A good feeling. Dreaming releases our fears into a safe realm of other-reality - our subconscious. If we didn't dream, our reality might be our dreams, or our fears. Stress or lack of sleep hinders our dreams. Dreaming is very important to our psyches (sp?). Just wanted to say how much I enjoyed your analysis. You're right when you say that you could look at every line and image and expand on it. Oh, and The Cheese Man. Joss may say he meant nothing. But I always thought of the aloneness of dreams, Buffy and the nursery rhyme with the last line - 'the cheese stands alone'. Thank you!!! Thanks, Karen. Yes, I have read that if people are deprived of dreams - i.e. their REM sleep in continually interrupted, it begins to have very detrimental effects. The Cheese stands alone, huh? I love it!! Sure fits in with the "alone" images we get. Since Buffy likes cheese, I sort of thought of the cheese as . . . fun or silliness. Thinking of what he says in each dream: The cheese is what Willow has to "make room for" - and she can be too serious, with her head in the books. It's what "won't protect" Xander (and he does use jokes and silliness for defense). In Giles' dream The CheeseMan says "I wear the cheese, it does not wear me" which strikes me as a stuffy adult view of fun. And in Buffy's dream, the appearance of The CheeseMan is the outrageous silliness that tells her it's "just a dream," her subconscious is "just funning" with her. Though I believe Joss about the CheeseMan representing the random, absurd element in dreams, I don't think the words he puts in the CheeseMan's mouth are entirely random. That wouldn't be like Joss, to waste so many words like that. And The CheeseMan definitely contributes to that sense of connectivity you mention - that despite our very real separateness, there is also a very real connection - so much so, with the Scoobies, that they connect, even in their lonely dreams. Yes - I agree - it is comforting.
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Post by Anne, Old S'cubie Cat on Dec 23, 2003 13:29:50 GMT -5
Spring, once again, I am in awe. That must have been a tough analysis to write; there're so many layers in Restless.
You not only took it apart as a single episode, you linked it to previous and future episodes. This one was pivotal in so many ways we could never have realized at the time. Well done!
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Post by thelittlestvampire on Dec 23, 2003 14:55:58 GMT -5
Hey Spring, I finally saw "Lies my parent Told Me" recently and I can't tell you how sad I am I can't read a review of yours about it. I've read a several reviews do far and I'm left cold. BTW- I don't like JM in the suit. I thought they put him in that icky tan color specifically because it's such a bad color on him. Spike's obviously a "winter."
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Post by SpringSummers on Dec 23, 2003 15:11:40 GMT -5
Spring, once again, I am in awe. That must have been a tough analysis to write; there're so many layers in Restless. You not only took it apart as a single episode, you linked it to previous and future episodes. This one was pivotal in so many ways we could never have realized at the time. Well done! Thanks for the feedback, Anne. I am glad you enjoyed it. Restless is notoriously linked to eps before and after. That is what is nice about doing these reviews years later - you can really get a much more complete picture.
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Post by SpringSummers on Dec 23, 2003 15:14:25 GMT -5
Hey Spring, I finally saw "Lies my parent Told Me" recently and I can't tell you how sad I am I can't read a review of yours about it. I've read a several reviews do far and I'm left cold. BTW- I don't like JM in the suit. I thought they put him in that icky tan color specifically because it's such a bad color on him. Spike's obviously a "winter." LMPTM? It's gonna be awhile before I get to that one - you'll have to settle for Fool for Love, which should be coming up for analysis in the next few months for me. Spike's obviously a winter? As far as the right season for Spike goes, there is only one answer: Spring!!!! Sorry, couldn't resist.
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Post by Rob on Dec 23, 2003 23:42:17 GMT -5
Spectacular. This is, quite simply, one of the best analyses of "Restless" I've ever seen...and I think I've seen hundreds.
If one held a gun to my head, I'd have to name this as my favorite episode. "Restless" actually became more relevant and important as time went by...yet it was a remarkable artistic achievement as it stood.
I made an effort (on another site) to dissect a piece of "Restless;" it pales in comparison with yours. Of all the work you've done, only "The Zeppo" is more important to me, for obvious reasons.
There are a ton of different things one can interpret from this episode, which is why it's so damn amazing. You go on a little ride inside each character's mind...but what does it all mean? That is left up to the individual viewer. Joss is literally asking for US to do some work...to figure out where he's taking this little show.
It's also interesting to note that "Restless" is almost smack dab in the middle of the series chronologically (#78 out of 144, to be exact). We are taking stock of what has happened to our heroes so far...and given little glimpses of where they are headed (though most of it only becomes clear in retrospect).
One or two things, Spring, that you didn't mention (as you said, there are SO many things to discuss here):
Tara tells Willow "You don't know everything about me." That - along with Tara's intentional miscue during Willow's demon-locator spell in a previous episode - sets up the events of "Family" in Season 5.
One other thing: I found it very interesting that Buffy is the one who brings Willow into that classroom and rips away her "clothing." Underneath it all, Willow is afraid to be exposed as someone "weak and accomodating."
Compared to Buffy The Vampire Slayer - the Shining Star, if you will - how can Willow ever find her own place? When will SHE get to shine? As long as Buffy is around, Willow is forever second-string.
In other words, she will always be the nerdy little girl - "Willow with her mousy ways," being ridiculed and/or ignored. Oz and Tara look at her knowingly. Xander cries out that no one cares what his best friend has to say.
Who brought her into that room and purposely exposed her again? Why...it was Buffy. One wonders if there is some underlying resentment of Buffy's power within the group.
The "mousy ways" quote is, of course, from Darth Rosenberg circa Season 6. When the darkness within was exposed to the, clearly we see rivalry issues with Buffy. I think some seeds are planted for that in "Restless."
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Post by SpringSummers on Dec 24, 2003 9:18:59 GMT -5
Spectacular. This is, quite simply, one of the best analyses of "Restless" I've ever seen...and I think I've seen hundreds. Thank you for taking the time to let me know this. Knowing what a fave this is of yours, that means a lot! Yes, I agree this directly sets up Family. It is interesting though how Tara does tell Willow that she "knows her real name," or something like that. This is Willow's dream, and I think this speaks to a deep underlying trust of Tara that Willow has (even if Tara doesn't completely trust herself at this point). Yes - I agree with every word. Willow's resentment of her "Buffy's sidekick" role shows in the fact that Buffy is the one to "reveal her," to "strip her down" to her nerdiness, so to speak. As you said, there is just so much going on in the episode. I truly do feel a "line-by-line," image-by-image," analysis could be done, but whew. Not for me. And as you also said, so much is left up to individual interpretation, that even if you did the "line-by-line" you'd never really get done! Interesting observation about how the ep is smack-dab in the middle. I had never noticed that. Rob, I assume from your lack of comment that you are satisfied and in agreement with the Xander-part of the analysis. Xander's dream was interesting in that it revealed a great deal about him, but - much more so than any of the other dreams - it also revealed a great deal about others. It fits with the "Xander sees things" role - Xander (like all of us) lets his biases and fear color his conscious realizations, but underneath it all, he is the one processing everything -and processing it correctly.
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Post by Rob on Dec 24, 2003 17:39:00 GMT -5
Yes, Spring, I thought your Xander analysis was superb. I have a thing or two to conribute, but alas, I don't have time at the moment. Headed to my Mom's house for Christmas Eve.
I was going to try to analyze each character individually, but this one is so dense with interpretive material. I see something new every time I watch it.
To use a musical analogy, I consider it comparable with early Miles Davis electric. Chaotic and scary and beautiful all at once. Something new pops to the ears every time I put "Bitches Brew" on my CD player, for example.
"Restless" is kinda like that.
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Post by Vlad on Dec 25, 2003 1:49:31 GMT -5
Spring, I finally managed to find the time to read your Restless analysis uninterupted and with the solitary intent it deserved. Funny enough, it happens to be Christmas Eve. *L* I am ever so glad that I did take this time to read it.
You have managed to take what is the most convoluted, non-linear, intangible episode of the entire 7 year run and point out imagery that I had missed. When the episode first aired I rather dismissed it. Then, I didn't think it was bad but it didn't hold my interest. It felt as an artistic attempt that, considering it's location at the end of the season, didn't work for a season finale. Primeval was truly that and I always felt that Restless was more like an epilogue.
Later, after watching a season or two more of the series, I began to realize that Restless was less an epilogue than a prologue for where the rest of the series was going. I enjoyed it more after that yet still was never that impressed with the episode. I never found the dream sequences all that dreamy And, I still don't. I can not think of a single movie or tv show that has ever depicted dreams or nightmares in any way close to how I perceive/feel them. That is quite possibly my own weirdness and perhaps it DOES represent well to the majority of others. On the other hand, the episode The Body so remarkably captures the feelings and thoughts of Buffy and the others in a way I can relate to it's downright spooky. I would say the whole feeling of The Body much better encompasses how my dreams feel than the actual dreaming in Restless. However, I thought the imagery was well done and the exploration of characters was very good. Restless moved higher in my estimation, but it hardly cracked the Vlad's Top Ten All-time Picks list.
Now, I have never been one to get too involved or engrossed in other's analyses of literature or cinema. If it's something I disliked, then the analysis of it was uninteresting and very unlikely to sway my feelings. This would be akin to "I tasted the brussel sprouts and they tasted terrible. No matter how much you tell me about hte terrific and extroidinary way they were prepared, the high quality of the growing, or the subtlties of the undertones in the accompaning vinegar will I like them anymore or even at all." On the other hand, if I really enjoy something, I prefer not to examine it all that hard. At some point in the disection the thing I enjoy begins to become much less than the sum of it's parts, like a piece of cheesecake topped with raspberries. Perhaps the raspberries on their own are a bit too tart, or the crust a bit too buttery. Maybe the filling is a little bland on it's own or a touch too sweet. But, when mixed as a whole, heaven.
Now, somewhere in the middle of these two extremes enters Restless. I didn't dislike it but I far from really enjoyed it. I rather dismissed it. I have seen others analyse portions of it and still it didn't do much for me. Then, I read your analysis and I enjoyed it. Through your eyes I began examining each of it's ingredients, watched how they blended together for you and it let me taste it again, anew. While the episode still doesn't make my Top Ten list, I am able to appreciate what it's doing and how. I see the hard work in it's preparation, and that it's a dish best tasted many times. It has found a place at my Buffy table. Perhaps it is the "soup"; jumbled bits floating in a savory broth. Not exactly filling, but there to stimulate the mouth and stomach in preparation for the entree and sides yet to come.
I would like to thank you for helping me to appreciate the soup. No one else seems to quite have that knack in analysis. Excellent job! I think I'll return for seconds.
Vlad
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Post by Nickim on Dec 25, 2003 16:01:32 GMT -5
Spring, I finally managed to find the time to read your Restless analysis uninterupted and with the solitary intent it deserved. Funny enough, it happens to be Christmas Eve. *L* I am ever so glad that I did take this time to read it. You have managed to take what is the most convoluted, non-linear, intangible episode of the entire 7 year run and point out imagery that I had missed. When the episode first aired I rather dismissed it. Then, I didn't think it was bad but it didn't hold my interest. It felt as an artistic attempt that, considering it's location at the end of the season, didn't work for a season finale. Primeval was truly that and I always felt that Restless was more like an epilogue. Later, after watching a season or two more of the series, I began to realize that Restless was less an epilogue than a prologue for where the rest of the series was going. I enjoyed it more after that yet still was never that impressed with the episode. I never found the dream sequences all that dreamy And, I still don't. I can not think of a single movie or tv show that has ever depicted dreams or nightmares in any way close to how I perceive/feel them. That is quite possibly my own weirdness and perhaps it DOES represent well to the majority of others. On the other hand, the episode The Body so remarkably captures the feelings and thoughts of Buffy and the others in a way I can relate to it's downright spooky. I would say the whole feeling of The Body much better encompasses how my dreams feel than the actual dreaming in Restless. However, I thought the imagery was well done and the exploration of characters was very good. Restless moved higher in my estimation, but it hardly cracked the Vlad's Top Ten All-time Picks list. Now, I have never been one to get too involved or engrossed in other's analyses of literature or cinema. If it's something I disliked, then the analysis of it was uninteresting and very unlikely to sway my feelings. This would be akin to "I tasted the brussel sprouts and they tasted terrible. No matter how much you tell me about hte terrific and extroidinary way they were prepared, the high quality of the growing, or the subtlties of the undertones in the accompaning vinegar will I like them anymore or even at all." On the other hand, if I really enjoy something, I prefer not to examine it all that hard. At some point in the disection the thing I enjoy begins to become much less than the sum of it's parts, like a piece of cheesecake topped with raspberries. Perhaps the raspberries on their own are a bit too tart, or the crust a bit too buttery. Maybe the filling is a little bland on it's own or a touch too sweet. But, when mixed as a whole, heaven. Now, somewhere in the middle of these two extremes enters Restless. I didn't dislike it but I far from really enjoyed it. I rather dismissed it. I have seen others analyse portions of it and still it didn't do much for me. Then, I read your analysis and I enjoyed it. Through your eyes I began examining each of it's ingredients, watched how they blended together for you and it let me taste it again, anew. While the episode still doesn't make my Top Ten list, I am able to appreciate what it's doing and how. I see the hard work in it's preparation, and that it's a dish best tasted many times. It has found a place at my Buffy table. Perhaps it is the "soup"; jumbled bits floating in a savory broth. Not exactly filling, but there to stimulate the mouth and stomach in preparation for the entree and sides yet to come. I would like to thank you for helping me to appreciate the soup. No one else seems to quite have that knack in analysis. Excellent job! I think I'll return for seconds. Vlad Wow, Vlad, you said everything I've ever thought about Restless and Spring's analysis, but you said it so much better than I ever could have. My dreams aren't anything like the way they're portrayed in TV, either.
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Post by SpringSummers on Dec 26, 2003 8:19:06 GMT -5
Rob: I thought Xander's dream was very well done and am curious about any thoughts you might want to add, should you get the time and desire to share.
Vlad: Thanks for the nice feedback. May I say, you are a good writer with a gift for analogy and a Clear Eye (for a straight guy), and if you ever find the time, I'd love to see you write more for the site. Maybe a guest AtS review? An essay? More fan-fic?
I know exactly what you mean about Restless not portraying the dream-experience in the spot-on way The Body portrays sudden, devastating loss. But it captures some elements of my own dreaming for me: The paranoia, the reflection of fears - I have definitely had dreams where, like Buffy trying to shout at Riley but getting a whisper, I try to talk or scream but I can't.
Otherwise, I don't think Restless was meant to portray the collective human dream-experience. I mean . . . it was meant to incorporate elements of the dream-experience as it feels to us all, but it was also meant to be more than that - the Scoobies are having an experience directly related to their connection to Slayerhood and otherworldliness. In The Body - the "totally our world" nature of Buffy's "mom-dying" experience is a key element. She's The Slayer, but mom dies of natural causes and there's not a thing she can do about it.
Having said that, I would love to see something where I truly thought the dream-experience was captured. I don't know if it is doable, but . . . Joss would surely be on my short-list of people I might hire to try it (you know, if I had oodles of money and could afford to hire Joss to produce and write and direct for me, SMG to act for me, and JM to . . . act for me, etc).
Nicki: Glad you enjoyed the analysis and took the time to let me know. Don't blame you for piggy-backing on Vlad's well-written words. The analyses take a lot of effort and knowing that they affect others in a positive way is very important to keeping me going on them!
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