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Post by rich on Mar 2, 2006 1:39:37 GMT -5
The exchange between Eko and Henry made me realize that Eko is more like a monk than a priest. Like a monk, Eko has a rule, a deliberate, mindful way of being in the world. His deliberateness and mindfulness remind me of the Sisters Jan used to work for.
The two locks of his beard were there to remind him of the two men he killed. When he confessed and asked forgiveness, and, I guess, felt he had received it, he removed the locks. Earlier this season, he went silent for 40 days to atone for another killing. I don't know if his rule is rooted in African practice, or whether, in the absence of any community or guidance, he's making it up as he goes along.
Presently Eko seems more concerned with personal salvation than with ministering to others. Hopefully that will change since he seems to me the most capable of the Losties.
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Post by RAKSHA on Mar 2, 2006 3:08:35 GMT -5
What a cute little baby. What a not cute prisioner. But a smart prisoner. Yup. And Locke's a complete idiot for letting a guy he doesn't even trust get to him so easily. I found it hard to figure out much of this episode.
Had Ethan really been Claire's doctor before she went on the plane, or is Claire confusing things in her memory, or did the drugs Ethan gave her do the confusing?
Um, why wouldn't Sun point out, as Claire was going all macho-Mom and going off with Kate to find medicine that was probably long-gone, that if something happened to Claire and she didn't come back, they had no way of feeding Aaron? Unless there's a handy stash of baby formula back in the hatch?
While the scene with Eko going Rail-splitter was appreciated, and he does not so much steal scenes as devour them, I didn't think that the Eko-Henry Gale scene accomplished anything. What was Eko trying to convey? I thought he was going to kill Henry after asking his forgiveness, but all Eko did was cut himself? Color me confused.
And what has happened to Locke's canny brain? He played manipulator himself last season and he doesn't recognize Henry as one? Gets all hot and bothered by what the prisoner said about Jack? Uh-oh. Locke's mind has gone on vacation, or has been dulled by playing house with Claire and the adorable baby.
Best thing about the episode was the revelation of the teenaged girl-Other probably being Rousseau's Alex, and taking steps to prevent a terrible act. I always enjoy seeing Rousseau; and she was certainly in fine form here.
What did the BOG say to Ethan about Claire - I didn't quite catch that?
Bets that Sun's indisposition will, by the end of the season, turn out to be the mysterious highly contagious and deadly illness that Rousseau told of (also Henry, but he may have been lying, and it may not have been the same disease) - Sun is liked by almost everyone, and a decision on having to kill or quarantine her (where?) would make for a gut-wrenching cliffhanger Season end. Maybe the Others would appear and offer a vaccine that could cure her, in exchange for baby Aaron, or something. Brrr.
GAIL
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Post by Matthew on Mar 2, 2006 3:26:50 GMT -5
Yup. And Locke's a complete idiot for letting a guy he doesn't even trust get to him so easily. I found it hard to figure out much of this episode.
Had Ethan really been Claire's doctor before she went on the plane, or is Claire confusing things in her memory, or did the drugs Ethan gave her do the confusing?
Um, why wouldn't Sun point out, as Claire was going all macho-Mom and going off with Kate to find medicine that was probably long-gone, that if something happened to Claire and she didn't come back, they had no way of feeding Aaron? Unless there's a handy stash of baby formula back in the hatch?
While the scene with Eko going Rail-splitter was appreciated, and he does not so much steal scenes as devour them, I didn't think that the Eko-Henry Gale scene accomplished anything. What was Eko trying to convey? I thought he was going to kill Henry after asking his forgiveness, but all Eko did was cut himself? Color me confused.
And what has happened to Locke's canny brain? He played manipulator himself last season and he doesn't recognize Henry as one? Gets all hot and bothered by what the prisoner said about Jack? Uh-oh. Locke's mind has gone on vacation, or has been dulled by playing house with Claire and the adorable baby.
Best thing about the episode was the revelation of the teenaged girl-Other probably being Rousseau's Alex, and taking steps to prevent a terrible act. I always enjoy seeing Rousseau; and she was certainly in fine form here.
What did the BOG say to Ethan about Claire - I didn't quite catch that?
Bets that Sun's indisposition will, by the end of the season, turn out to be the mysterious highly contagious and deadly illness that Rousseau told of (also Henry, but he may have been lying, and it may not have been the same disease) - Sun is liked by almost everyone, and a decision on having to kill or quarantine her (where?) would make for a gut-wrenching cliffhanger Season end. Maybe the Others would appear and offer a vaccine that could cure her, in exchange for baby Aaron, or something. Brrr.
GAIL Ethan had her doped up on scopalamine or some hypnotic, and had her convinced that she was still in Sydney, preparing to go to drop her baby off in L.A. Those scenes where Ethan was her doctor all ocurred in the Caduceus station. I think Eko was seeking out a confessor-figure, as there are no other priests on the island: he needs to be shrived, and informing the "kin" of the men he killed served that purpose. Or so I thought. Hence the cutting out of the memory locks in his beard. He was chewing Ethan out for grabbing her immediately, rather than finishing the shopping list, and waiting until they could grab everyone en masse, as they did with the tail-enders. Ethan countered with the fact that the Fronties had a passenger manifest, and he had lost his cover, and had to act expeditiously.
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Post by RAKSHA on Mar 2, 2006 3:36:20 GMT -5
Thanx, Matthew. I just hope that the "shopping list" wasn't a literal shopping list, and the 'good ones' being some kind of food, either physical or psychic, for the Others. Now there's a ghastly thought.
GAIL
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Post by Lola m on Mar 2, 2006 8:31:29 GMT -5
I absolutely loved this episode!!! I really like Libby! she is growing on me faster everytime she is onscreen!! I think she worked at the psych ward while hurley was there. they better not make her into a bad person why did they leave that hatch after only a few months? **nods a lot** This is what I want to know!! This just adds to the whole idea of it being an experiment. I mean, why were the Others making themselves look like raggedy feral people instead of smooth labcoat people? Really took me by surprise too! I love that they can still do that to me. Either that or they're gonna do a "it's a mutant baby secretly implanted in her" storyline.
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Post by Lola m on Mar 2, 2006 8:35:37 GMT -5
The exchange between Eko and Henry made me realize that Eko is more like a monk than a priest. Like a monk, Eko has a rule, a deliberate, mindful way of being in the world. His deliberateness and mindfulness remind me of the Sisters Jan used to work for. The two locks of his beard were there to remind him of the two men he killed. When he confessed and asked forgiveness, and, I guess, felt he had received it, he removed the locks. Earlier this season, he went silent for 40 days to atone for another killing. I don't know if his rule is rooted in African practice, or whether, in the absence of any community or guidance, he's making it up as he goes along. Presently Eko seems more concerned with personal salvation than with ministering to others. Hopefully that will change since he seems to me the most capable of the Losties. A while back, a friend of mine told me how 40 days is a traditional time of mourning in several/many societies. Your comparison of Eko to a monk is a very interesting way of looking at his character.
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Post by Lola m on Mar 2, 2006 8:44:25 GMT -5
Yup. And Locke's a complete idiot for letting a guy he doesn't even trust get to him so easily. I found it hard to figure out much of this episode.
Had Ethan really been Claire's doctor before she went on the plane, or is Claire confusing things in her memory, or did the drugs Ethan gave her do the confusing?It sure had it confusing moments, eh? I think that it was just like Libby suggested - that Claire was confusing the memories. ;D Yeah, it wasn't the most logical concept. But since when have the Losties been all that logical. IMHO, I think Eko completely believes that BalloonMan Henry is an Other and he was sending a message. A message that he knew about his Otherness and a message to the other Others that he was sorry he killed those guys. Well, and also I think he meant to scare the crap out of Henry. That was the least believable thing about the whole ep for me. And yet, I also really like what Matthew said. That it still got to him because it really pushed exactly the right button. That even though he knows it is manipulation, he feels soooo strongly about it that he can't help reacting even as he knows what BalloonMan is trying to do. Rousseau was fab! What a nice bunch of twists and turns. I'll let someone else tackle that, as I didn't catch all of it myself and didn't make notes of the stuff I did catch. [/color][/quote] I have similar thoughts about Sun myself. It would fit with Rousseau's cryptic remarks about them doing what they need to do. And with Sun taking care of the baby - since my other theory (if the drug wasn't a placebo) is that the stuff they injected Claire and baby with was something to make them into carriers of the whatever-it-is sickness.
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Post by Sara on Mar 2, 2006 9:02:20 GMT -5
It was a red Caduceus. (medical symbol: stick with snakes. Mercury's wand.) Huh. Mercury there: Zeus is symbolized as a swan, an arrow stands for Apollo... wonder if the other stations will have an ox, a bow, or other greco-roman symbols. So, they're mixing their mythologies? Nah--just substitute Hermes for Mercury and it's all Greek to us.
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Post by Sara on Mar 2, 2006 9:03:58 GMT -5
infection --> evil baby? Rousseau was ominious. Ooh, the anticipation... Like Eko giving food to the guy in the pit. What did Eko just do? Eko vs Sayid's treatment of Henry. Aaron and Claire. Aw.... He heard through the door? Really? So, which one are you? Henry's getting to Locke! Spooky!!!!!! He's definitely up to no good. I'm really shocked he got to Locke. I mean, it was pretty obvious. Locke must be sooooo much more upset inside than he is letting show to have it get to him that much and that fast. I realized later on that Henry hit one of Locke's biggest buttons: "don't tell me what I can't do." Still pissed that Locke fell for it, though.
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Post by Karen on Mar 2, 2006 9:59:36 GMT -5
I'm really shocked he got to Locke. I mean, it was pretty obvious. Locke must be sooooo much more upset inside than he is letting show to have it get to him that much and that fast. I realized later on that Henry hit one of Locke's biggest buttons: "don't tell me what I can't do." Still pissed that Locke fell for it, though. Yeah, I was disappointed in Locke, too. Of course, when he does quit reacting negatively to that button being pushed he'll probably die - or ascend. Whatever.
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Post by Karen on Mar 2, 2006 10:05:48 GMT -5
I found it hard to figure out much of this episode.
Had Ethan really been Claire's doctor before she went on the plane, or is Claire confusing things in her memory, or did the drugs Ethan gave her do the confusing? It sure had it confusing moments, eh? I think that it was just like Libby suggested - that Claire was confusing the memories. ;D Yeah, it wasn't the most logical concept. But since when have the Losties been all that logical. IMHO, I think Eko completely believes that BalloonMan Henry is an Other and he was sending a message. A message that he knew about his Otherness and a message to the other Others that he was sorry he killed those guys. Well, and also I think he meant to scare the crap out of Henry.That was the least believable thing about the whole ep for me. And yet, I also really like what Matthew said. That it still got to him because it really pushed exactly the right button. That even though he knows it is manipulation, he feels soooo strongly about it that he can't help reacting even as he knows what BalloonMan is trying to do. Rousseau was fab! What a nice bunch of twists and turns. I'll let someone else tackle that, as I didn't catch all of it myself and didn't make notes of the stuff I did catch. [/color][/quote] I have similar thoughts about Sun myself. It would fit with Rousseau's cryptic remarks about them doing what they need to do. And with Sun taking care of the baby - since my other theory (if the drug wasn't a placebo) is that the stuff they injected Claire and baby with was something to make them into carriers of the whatever-it-is sickness. [/quote] Henry did look frightened, but it didn't stop him from ignoring Eko's advice to 'stop talking'. Hmm. Now I'm wondering if the walls have ears. Henry said told Jack that the walls were 'thin' - and that's why he could hear them, but I really wonder if there aren't 'bugs' in the hatch.
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Post by Sara on Mar 2, 2006 10:23:46 GMT -5
Whoa. I can't take credit for making this connection (just read about it on another site), but check out this exchange between Claire and the folks who were going to adopt her baby back in the first season ep "Raised by Another":
CLAIRE: I just want to make sure that you're gonna take really good care of the baby.
ARLENE STEWART: Of course we will.
MR. SLAVITT (ATTORNEY): Now, I'll need you to sign and date here where indicated.
(He hands the paper and pen to Claire. She picks the pen up.)
CLAIRE: Do you know "Catch a Falling Star"? It's a song, like a lullaby.
ARLENE STEWART: "Catch a falling star and put it in your pocket."
CLAIRE: My dad used to sing that to me when I was little. Do you think you could sing it to the baby once in a while?
ARLENE STEWART: Of course.
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Post by Karen on Mar 2, 2006 10:48:38 GMT -5
Whoa. I can't take credit for making this connection (just read about it on another site), but check out this exchange between Claire and the folks who were going to adopt her baby back in the first season ep "Raised by Another": CLAIRE: I just want to make sure that you're gonna take really good care of the baby.
ARLENE STEWART: Of course we will.
MR. SLAVITT (ATTORNEY): Now, I'll need you to sign and date here where indicated.
(He hands the paper and pen to Claire. She picks the pen up.)
CLAIRE: Do you know "Catch a Falling Star"? It's a song, like a lullaby.
ARLENE STEWART: "Catch a falling star and put it in your pocket."
CLAIRE: My dad used to sing that to me when I was little. Do you think you could sing it to the baby once in a while?
ARLENE STEWART: Of course.Oh, thank you, Sara! I was wracking my brain last night after rewatching - trying to remember where we heard that song before. Should have figured it was in one of Claire's episodes. Hmmm...
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Post by Matthew on Mar 2, 2006 10:53:23 GMT -5
I found it hard to figure out much of this episode.
Had Ethan really been Claire's doctor before she went on the plane, or is Claire confusing things in her memory, or did the drugs Ethan gave her do the confusing? It sure had it confusing moments, eh? I think that it was just like Libby suggested - that Claire was confusing the memories. ;D Yeah, it wasn't the most logical concept. But since when have the Losties been all that logical. IMHO, I think Eko completely believes that BalloonMan Henry is an Other and he was sending a message. A message that he knew about his Otherness and a message to the other Others that he was sorry he killed those guys. Well, and also I think he meant to scare the crap out of Henry.That was the least believable thing about the whole ep for me. And yet, I also really like what Matthew said. That it still got to him because it really pushed exactly the right button. That even though he knows it is manipulation, he feels soooo strongly about it that he can't help reacting even as he knows what BalloonMan is trying to do. Rousseau was fab! What a nice bunch of twists and turns. I'll let someone else tackle that, as I didn't catch all of it myself and didn't make notes of the stuff I did catch. [/color][/quote] I have similar thoughts about Sun myself. It would fit with Rousseau's cryptic remarks about them doing what they need to do. And with Sun taking care of the baby - since my other theory (if the drug wasn't a placebo) is that the stuff they injected Claire and baby with was something to make them into carriers of the whatever-it-is sickness. [/quote] I'd say he succeeded. Or maybe it was just me it worked on.I rewatched that scene: Gale set him up subtlely for it, at first, with the discussion of Dostoevskii versus Hemmingway. It was only after he figured out that Locke saw himself as a Hemmingway-esque romantic figure: that he felt a strong connection with Hemmingway, that he asked the question as to whether Locke was the one who stayed in the shadow or not. Still somewhat subtle. Then, when he saw the blow had landed, he abandoned all pretense of subtlety: I think he figured that the insidious worm was already there, and just needed a little feeding by a question or two.
I'd compare it to a situation where a lawyer asks a question in open court that the judge immediately orders stricken: it's not proper or fair, or officially part of what is to be considered, but it's still there.
And clearly, even though Locke's a pretty damned good manipulator, himself, he's feeling a loss of control since he got skunked by Sawyer and faced down by Jack on the button. He's losing his zen, looks like. He's being defied in serving the Island, and it bothers him: Gale's only voicing questions he's had in his own mind, already.
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Post by Matthew on Mar 2, 2006 10:55:06 GMT -5
So, they're mixing their mythologies? Nah--just substitute Hermes for Mercury and it's all Greek to us. *Groans* What she said: Hermes. Yeah, that's it. Hermes.
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