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Post by William the Bloody on Nov 3, 2004 17:21:07 GMT -5
Heee! I like this real-time posting thing.  It's like we're peeking into your head. Only not in a creepy way.  ;D Lola So when do we get to try the creepy way?  Vlad |
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Post by William the Bloody on Nov 3, 2004 17:27:20 GMT -5
Just chiming in with the Logan curiousity: how far down the road to permanently "wrong" is this kid? Did anyone else notice that when Logan chose the belt for his punishment, he made it into a noose-like loop before taking it to Daddy? Was it meant to signify that he's suicidal? Or was it a weapon? Deep, dark thoughts today. Neither. He folded the belt over like his father will when using it as a whip. He gave it a snap,reflecting on how it was going to feel hitting his backside. Vlad |
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Post by Lola m on Nov 4, 2004 8:32:44 GMT -5
So when do we get to try the creepy way? Vlad  Lola |
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Post by Lola m on Nov 4, 2004 8:36:03 GMT -5
Just chiming in with the Logan curiousity: how far down the road to permanently "wrong" is this kid? Did anyone else notice that when Logan chose the belt for his punishment, he made it into a noose-like loop before taking it to Daddy? Was it meant to signify that he's suicidal? Or was it a weapon? Deep, dark thoughts today. I am also really wondering how broken Logan is. Between his dad and Lily's murder . . . . He's really holding a lot of stuff inside, I think. Lola |
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Post by SpringSummers on Nov 4, 2004 8:39:53 GMT -5
So when do we get to try the creepy way? Vlad I'll let you all take the creepy way to getting inside my brain for the next ep review, if you like. I warn you - it's pretty damn scary. There's the dark, unholy thoughts, the memories of bad boys, and most of all - cobwebs! |
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Post by SpringSummers on Nov 4, 2004 8:41:10 GMT -5
I am also really wondering how broken Logan is. Between his dad and Lily's murder . . . . He's really holding a lot of stuff inside, I think. Lola Yes - the dry heaving from last week was a perfect metaphor. He's so young, and he's shown an actual capacity for both love and remorse . . . at this point, I put him in the "totally redeemable" column. |
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Post by Sue on Nov 4, 2004 21:25:19 GMT -5
You know, I didn't even quite grasp how stupid the Pirate Points were****until Duncan did his speech at the end and I was like, you mean band and honor roll and school play and stuff weren't earning points before?!  ***** I mean, it was bad enough when I just thought that the kids not getting points were the ones who didn't do any extracurricular stuff at all, were basically just students. But then to finally grasp (I guess I'm not that bright, huh?) the total system of selecting specific types of activities for points. Woah. That is totally messed up. Not as messed up as Logan's dad - but still! I was gonna guess more of what in my day were called burn-outs or stoners (gosh, that sounds so old fashioned) - basically the sorta druggie kids; I mean not the total addicts, but the fringers. (Ah, sweet memories of high school and the various clicques. What fun.  ) Lola Extremely late to the party, but I'll post a few responses anyway. I see Rae was spot on with several predictions. And--I'm with Lola on the above comment. (When my review gets posted you can see I commented.) Getting quicker on the writing, but uncontrollable RL screwed up my WEd writing time once again. Sue |
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Post by Sue on Nov 4, 2004 21:27:08 GMT -5
Yep. His daddy has sure messed with his mind.  And now I understand why he has some of the mannerisms he does. Why he seems to be really just . . . observe people a lot. Especially people doing anything good or kind (like Duncan and the lunch table kid). Like he's trying to figure out what they're doing, or what the catch is. Guess he's used to the public face with the hidden reality, huh? Lola Excellent observation. And--Vlad anticipated the direction I took with the 3 fathers. |
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Post by Sue on Nov 4, 2004 21:28:22 GMT -5
Me. I like Harry Hamlin in the role of Logan's dad. And Lisa (I think her name is) the soap opera host with the cool hair as his mom. I hope we see more of her, too. And yeah, she was very disconnected and probably abused -either verbally or otherwise. I hope we see Veronica and her dad work together to solve Lily's murder. It looks like they are heading in that direction. Obviously those shoes were a plant. Lisa Rinna. They are married. Did somebody already mention that? |
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Post by Sue on Nov 4, 2004 21:32:57 GMT -5
Logan is young and stupid and screwed up, but good heart - I actually think he does have a good heart. Not yet totally convinced of that. Not sure Logan knows. He strikes me very much as a "situational ethics" type of guy who will mainly do whatever keeps him (and his heart) most protected. I think he and Lilly were together because they were both so wounded (by their parents). Even if she had a "thing" with Weevil in a sense she and Logan were still soulmates. Would Logan have killed her after finding out about Weevil? Don't abused children sometimes have violent, uncontrollable tempers? |
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Post by Sue on Nov 4, 2004 21:37:35 GMT -5
Huh.. I did notice the voice break myself.. but I was so disgusted with the bum-boxing that I didn't let it intrude into my consciousness. I suppose Spring's right, that he is merely young, and that's supposed to highlight it, but I have this internal moral certainty (to be read as "priggishness" at times) that some things are just... wrong... I can be judgemental at times. I can see how his moral sense was blunted by being raised by the morally ambiguous (at best) father. Matthew--I'm in total agreement that some things are just wrong, but I also don't see how a child is supposed to grow up knowing where that line is when there is no instruction of role-modeling from the parent. In fact--the opposite is modeled. Every kid knows their father is supposed to love them--not beat them--yet this moral imperative is perverted in the Echols household. He even makes Logan complicit in his own beating--requiring him to pick out and bring the belt. (Like having to cut your own birch branch?). Makes Logan think that the beating is somehow deserved and acceptable behavior. How in heck is Logan going to grow up knowing right from wrong? |
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Post by SpringSummers on Nov 5, 2004 9:27:41 GMT -5
Not yet totally convinced of that. Not sure Logan knows. He strikes me very much as a "situational ethics" type of guy who will mainly do whatever keeps him (and his heart) most protected. I think he and Lilly were together because they were both so wounded (by their parents). Even if she had a "thing" with Weevil in a sense she and Logan were still soulmates. Would Logan have killed her after finding out about Weevil? Don't abused children sometimes have violent, uncontrollable tempers? I wonder what is going on with Weevil and Logan & Lilly. I don't think she had a "thing" with Weevil, but something is up there. Remember when Weevil and Logan resolved things about Paris Hilton (don't remember the character name) by stepping aside and talking to one another? Logan is not on my list of Lily-killer suspects. I would go so far as to say, in my mind it's a "no way." His approach to making that Lily video struck me as completely genuine . . . he even set aside his Veronica-animosity to do it. No - like Veronica, he's been devastated by the death. I think we get quite a few Logan/Veronica parallels, because they've both lost their first-loves and are, in very different ways, acting out. Veronica has a much stronger home base than Logan, and has turned her hurt and anger toward do-gooding (mostly, sorta) while Logan, with a very different environment and upbringing, has turned his hurt and anger toward less savory actions. Time for me to read your review! I'll be back!! |
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Post by Sue on Nov 5, 2004 9:33:29 GMT -5
I wonder what is going on with Weevil and Logan & Lilly. I don't think she had a "thing" with Weevil, but something is up there. Remember when Weevil and Logan resolved things about Paris Hilton (don't remember the character name) by stepping aside and talking to one another? Logan is not on my list of Lily-killer suspects. I would go so far as to say, in my mind it's a "no way." His approach to making that Lily video struck me as completely genuine . . . he even set aside his Veronica-animosity to do it. No - like Veronica, he's been devastated by the death. I think we get quite a few Logan/Veronica parallels, because they've both lost their first-loves and are, in very different ways, acting out. Veronica has a much stronger home base than Logan, and has turned her hurt and anger toward do-gooding (mostly, sorta) while Logan, with a very different environment and upbringing, has turned his hurt and anger toward less savory actions. Time for me to read your review! I'll be back!! All excellent points. Yeah, I got momentarily sucked in by Wanda's sly hint. Definitely have to think outside the box on the Lilly/Weevil connection. For one thing--he's way smarter than his cousin and I really don't think he'd play hidden boy-toy for Lilly. So--assuming (and I think it's not a red herring) that there is a L/W connection and it's not about boyfriend/girlfriend, wonder what they were colluding over? Yeah, sweeps month. And, still asking--wonder what Rob Thomas has planned future-wise for the series. He had an order for 13 eps, now 17 (strange number)--at what point does he "solve" the murder mystery and then what does he move on to? |
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Post by SpringSummers on Nov 5, 2004 10:50:55 GMT -5
Sue - nice job. I appreciate you sharing your careful viewing and I think you hit the major themes.
I kinda wondered about this. I mean, I think, underneath it all, Duncan DID want to enter the race - hence the half-hearted protest, and in the end, embracement of his new role.
I thought Logan's reaction here suggested very strongly that he didn't do the "narc" thing - because when he does stuff, he likes people to know he did it. He is nasty in a lot of ways, but he isn't sneaky.
Glad you quoted this line about saving your future by "wrecking" mine. I thought it related right back to the parent/child theme. Possibly wrecking Logan's future by trying to save his own is just what Aaron is doing to Logan. And Jake has a bit of this going on as well. I mean - he's willing to concede that Duncan has a right to live in a hut and carve, but FIRST, he wants Duncan to do him proud. It's a much gentler version of the "don't embarrass me" thing we got from Aaron and Lily's mom (nice catch!).
I thought it was very much about how parents identify with their children and have a hard time separating their own identities from that of their children. Your future = my future. What you do isn't just about you, it's just as much about me . . . you = me.
The "you're new" - possibly related to the whole family theme. "You're not a part of the family."
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Post by Techno-bot on Nov 5, 2004 17:22:01 GMT -5
This part was missing its buttons for awhile. It's fixed now.
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It's like we're peeking into your head. 
;D
