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Post by S'ewing S'cubie on Oct 21, 2003 6:39:28 GMT -5
I always thought that Spike's egg-deal had to do with wanting to get money for Buffy too - but of course, no matter how you look at it, it still points where it points: Spike just doesn't really get it, when it comes to right and wrong. As the exchange goes at the wedding: SPIKE: Evil. BUFFY: Of course. I always thought of it as doing the right thing the wrong way. Right thing: getting money to help Buffy. Wrong way: housing and selling demon eggs for profit.
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Post by S'ewing S'cubie on Oct 21, 2003 6:41:20 GMT -5
If nekkid Spike scenes help keep Spike on AtvS, and AtvS on TV, I'm all for them. Hopefully the nekkid Spike moments won't be gratuitous, and there will be strategic use of shadows or whatever.
I remember the nekkid Angel scene very well, and didn't object to it at all....[shadow=red,left,300]GAIL [/shadow] Gratuitous naked Spike is fine with me. He can gratuitous as much as he likes... He doesn't even have to gratuitious...as long as he does it naked.
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Post by S'ewing S'cubie on Oct 21, 2003 6:46:14 GMT -5
Just shows to go you how very much the CoW was in need of a feminist revolution. Also - maybe that's why there was only one chosen - way too expensive to pay for more than one slayer. And the wages? death! Really, I am so in agreement here: what a bunch of pikers, patriarchs, and prigs. (alliteration, much?) I commented before on the CoW's (God, what an appropriate acronym!) parsimonious ways. Buffy, at least, had a mother and a home in her early years. Joyce supported the two of them comfortably if not luxuriously. But Faith lived in that fleabag motel and had to beg off paying her rent. Having seen the slum conditions in New York c. 1970's I hate to think about the conditions Robin Wood and his nother Nikki lived under.
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Post by S'ewing S'cubie on Oct 21, 2003 6:47:03 GMT -5
LParish I am surprised that you would say that!!! Hollywood? exploitative!! They are so not!! They would never exploit an actor because he has an attractive body. That would be just....wrong! ;D Would it be all right to exploit an actor because he DIDN'T have an attractive body?
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Post by S'ewing S'cubie on Oct 21, 2003 6:50:11 GMT -5
I'm equally surprised now that you've got me thinking about it. Was the woman who wrote her thesis on Spike ("Checkpoint," I think) a Watcher or just some Council administrative assistant? She certainly had the repressed female look down pat. The scarcity of women in positions of power within the organization suggests to me that the Council is at best patriarchal and at worst misogynist. There certainly were no women around the First Watchers' campfire. We know Faith's Watcher, killed by Kakistos, was female but we're given no other information about her. The most assertive female Watcher we see at length is Gwendolyn Post. And she was crazy! Maybe she went to the Dark Side because she couldn't stand being treated like a second-class citizen anymore. Dark side or not, she was as much a tight-ass as Quentin himself.
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Post by Sandy - lparish on Oct 21, 2003 7:11:07 GMT -5
LParish I am surprised that you would say that!!! Hollywood? exploitative!! They are so not!! They would never exploit an actor because he has an attractive body. That would be just....wrong! ;D And all the good guys wear white hats.
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Post by DaveCrenshaw on Oct 21, 2003 7:20:55 GMT -5
I'm equally surprised now that you've got me thinking about it. Was the woman who wrote her thesis on Spike ("Checkpoint," I think) a Watcher or just some Council administrative assistant? She certainly had the repressed female look down pat. The scarcity of women in positions of power within the organization suggests to me that the Council is at best patriarchal and at worst misogynist. There certainly were no women around the First Watchers' campfire. We know Faith's Watcher, killed by Kakistos, was female but we're given no other information about her. The most assertive female Watcher we see at length is Gwendolyn Post. And she was crazy! Maybe she went to the Dark Side because she couldn't stand being treated like a second-class citizen anymore. My impression was that the entourage that followed Quentin around like little lost puppies in "Checkpoint" were all junior Watchers, not unlike Wesley was there in his early days. We do know there are more Watchers running around out there than just Giles and Quentin (or at least were, while Quentin was still alive) and not all of them have Slayers or potentials to babysit. The folks that Quentin entrusted to accompany him to Sunnydale that trip seemed much too educated and involved in the process of quizzing Buffy and her friends to be simply admin geeks, but at the same time they were nowhere near as seasoned as Giles, Merrick, Robson or any of the other Watchers we've seen even briefly. But it is quite evident that the Watchers are traditionally a boys-only club, probably having succumbed at some point to anti-discrimination laws. An organization as large and with as many employees as the Watchers Council might remain secret to the world at large, but it's doubtful they could remain under the radar of most governments, and the insinuation with the Initiative was that the government did at least know the demon world was for real, real enough to involve military forces to investigate it. Therefore it goes to reason that at some point, the Watchers were forced to allow women in and allow them to ascend the ranks as Watchers, albeit I'm sure the Watchers weren't happy about having girls invading their locker room.
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Post by DaveCrenshaw on Oct 21, 2003 7:21:23 GMT -5
And all the good guys wear white hats. Liar.
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Post by DaveCrenshaw on Oct 21, 2003 7:52:26 GMT -5
Gratuitous naked Spike is fine with me. He can gratuitous as much as he likes... He doesn't even have to gratuitious...as long as he does it naked. Something tells me that we won't be getting the strategically placed shadows. BtVS S6, James spent a goodly amount of time nekkid except for his sock, and UPN saw no need to post the warning, even though BtVS aired during the traditional "family hour". And yet, with AtS airing an hour later, the WB felt the need to not only air warnings on the episode itself, but on the promos. Granted this is a different network, but still one that's known for playing up to the younger audience not unlike UPN did. Hence I'm expecting some NYPD Blue-esque butt shots. Could be worse -- could be "Andy Sipowitz, vampire with a soul". Then again, he could be wearing a parka and eight layers of clothes in every scene, and the whole thing is just a publicity stunt to get us to tune in.
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Post by Sue on Oct 21, 2003 7:53:50 GMT -5
This: www.original-midnight.org/kallysten/ will take you to kallysten's website. (Writer of "Her Sire/His Child" series.) Once there, under "announcements" click on "here" to see a very unique picture of Spike. *********** One of our new members is another fanfic writer: "spikealicious" has a long, long, story at fanfiction.net. Well, a first story: "One Normal Life" followed by a monster sequel, "One Normal Life, Two Extraordinary Lives". The first is set near the end of season 7, the second is return of Spike, post Chosen. Lots and lots of detail. ********** Off-topic: I'd appreciate any good thoughts and prayers for Allison today. She had one of those days on the Hellmouth yesterday which occassionally happen to all of us, but is especially tough for a 16 year old hormone bomb. Then, had to be up early and spend all day taking the PSAT test today (similar to the SAT--"college boards"--but this one is used to qualify to be a "National Merit Scholar"--which both her brother and sister did, so she is stressed out beyond belief--crying when she got in the car--and the other mothers and dads out there know that the hardest thing in the world is to watch your child hurting and not be able to DO anything about it. So, thanks for letting me vent.)
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Post by Sue on Oct 21, 2003 7:58:46 GMT -5
Thinking of JM taking time off to film movie.
Some of these early episodes seem to be (nicely) "Spike-heavy". I'm unspoiled but I assume if he goes off to film a movie there will be a time frame there where he is either totally or mostly absent.
So, to explain his absence the writers could say (assuming he become corporeal and able to leave LA) that he had gone to Europe to see Buffy.
(Yeah, I hate the idea of such a vital piece of history taking place off-camera.)
Then he returns, Angel asks how it went, Spike mutters disgustedly, "She said something about trying to decide between chocolate chip and oatmeal raisin."
BTW, a fic was posted at AAS yesterday, "A View of the Ocean" by OneTwoMany which does a nice job of a post-Chosen meeting between Buffy and Spike which would allow them to be together and yet would not require Buffy's presence on "Angel."
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Post by Betsy on Oct 21, 2003 8:01:10 GMT -5
Is everyone gearing up for what looks to be a great episode tomorrow nite?
Man, it's been so unbelievable here the last week. We do get rain up here in the PNW, but what we have been getting lately in the last week just about borders on the ridiculous. Last week in about 3 days, we got over 7 inches.
Yesterday, Seattle got 5 inches, that's just in one day. We have about 6 counties with rivers expected to go about 12 feet above flood level. Was watching the news last nite, lots of creeks are flooding also and there has been lots of urban and city flooding.
Quite a few schools are closed today and quite a few bus services aren't running cuz of flooding. And it is supposed to rain for the rest of the week.
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Post by DaveCrenshaw on Oct 21, 2003 8:03:04 GMT -5
Thinking of JM taking time off to film movie. Some of these early episodes seem to be (nicely) "Spike-heavy". I'm unspoiled but I assume if he goes off to film a movie there will be a time frame there where he is either totally or mostly absent. So, to explain his absence the writers could say (assuming he become corporeal and able to leave LA) that he had gone to Europe to see Buffy. (Yeah, I hate the idea of such a vital piece of history taking place off-camera.) Then he returns, Angel asks how it went, Spike mutters disgustedly, "She said something about trying to decide between chocolate chip and oatmeal raisin." BTW, a fic was posted at AAS yesterday, "A View of the Ocean" by OneTwoMany which does a nice job of a post-Chosen meeting between Buffy and Spike which would allow them to be together and yet would not require Buffy's presence on "Angel." Both Sarah Michelle Gellar and Alyson Hannigan have been able to take time from their work on BtVS to make movies, and both were in every single episode of the show. It can happen. There are breaks in the filming schedules, and if the movie producer wants a certain star bad enough, they'll work around any other commitments the star might have, such as filming a TV series concurrently. After all, it's James' success in the Buffyverse that has made him a household name, which is why the movie producers want him in the first place, so they figure it's a reasonable tradeoff.
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Post by Betsy on Oct 21, 2003 8:05:31 GMT -5
I'm really a baseball girl at heart but: Hey! How about those Chiefs? 7-0 and a goal line stand - not too shabby. This would make them the only undefeated team in the NFL along with (drumroll, please) Rob's Vikings. Now, does anyone want to hear about the Bangladeshi cricket test match that's all the news over here ? And my Seahawks are 5-1 . . . considering where we've been the last 10 years, I'm like so psyched this season. We haven't been this since the 80's. A lot of "experts" said that Seattle could be the sleeper in the NFC West and I guess there were right. We got this rookie from WSU, Trufont, who's like unbelievable.
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Post by Betsy on Oct 21, 2003 8:06:54 GMT -5
Gratuitous naked Spike is fine with me. He can gratuitous as much as he likes... He doesn't even have to gratuitious...as long as he does it naked. That wouldn't be bad, but then I want some gratuitious Angel scenes as well. ;D
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