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Post by Karen on Feb 9, 2006 0:09:11 GMT -5
Ah! She was the long con. That's a really nice twist! I like it! I was sure it was gonna turn out she was conning him. But is the death threat also a con? Or is his partner in on it with her? That's the problem with cons - they're always sooooo convoluted. A con man always uses the weaknesses of the people he's conning. Well, duh! Of course he wants people to hate him. You rob. I con. A tiger don't change his stripes. (I always thought it was "a leopard don't change his spots".) Awwww. Hurley did get Sayid out of his funk with the transmitter project. Um. Why are they getting radio signals from the 1940's? Hurley - I love you!! "Or any time." Yes!!!!!! Ooooh. Conspirators! Aaaaaaaand it was a con. So, was the partner who threatened him in on it, or did the partner get one in his ear? I'm not a good person, Charlie. Perfect!!!! 'Cuz he's really not. Next week. Ooh! Torture! And finally someone stops pushing the damn button!
Life is good again. #metoo# It's sweeps week! ;D
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Post by SpringSummers on Feb 9, 2006 8:44:37 GMT -5
Oh...my...goodness. Now, that's what I'm talkin' about! Wow! I'm in love with Charlie. I'm seriously messed up. Seriously. And Sawyer - but you all knew that already. Huh. So, now we know Charlie wasn't and hasn't been using. He's got it in so bad for Locke that he was willing to put Sun in danger. Man, Jin is going to be so pissed if he finds out. Vincent. How does he figure in there?Actually, I didn't believe Charlie when he said he didn't participate in the plan in order to get the heroin. I mean - I believe him that he did it in part to "get Locke," and I think he may believe himself, at least while he's talking. But . . . Sawyer, (so astute in the study of others that he pulled off this complex con) didn't believe Charlie, not really, and neither do I. I'm not sure whether Charlie is, was, or has been using on the Island. But he's still "under the spell" of the heroin, and that's part of what Sawyer used to get Charlie to agree to participate with the plan. Charlie lies when it comes to the heroin. I don't trust a word he says. And Vincent - good question! I'm not sure if he's a harbringer of evil or what. No doubt there is some sort of pattern to the way he shows up.
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Post by SpringSummers on Feb 9, 2006 8:46:52 GMT -5
Ah! She was the long con. That's a really nice twist! I like it! I was sure it was gonna turn out she was conning him. But is the death threat also a con? Or is his partner in on it with her? That's the problem with cons - they're always sooooo convoluted. A con man always uses the weaknesses of the people he's conning. Well, duh! Of course he wants people to hate him. You rob. I con. A tiger don't change his stripes. (I always thought it was "a leopard don't change his spots".) Awwww. Hurley did get Sayid out of his funk with the transmitter project. Um. Why are they getting radio signals from the 1940's? Hurley - I love you!! "Or any time." Yes!!!!!! Ooooh. Conspirators! Aaaaaaaand it was a con. So, was the partner who threatened him in on it, or did the partner get one in his ear? I'm not a good person, Charlie. Perfect!!!! 'Cuz he's really not. Next week. Ooh! Torture! And finally someone stops pushing the damn button!
Life is good again. It's sweeps week! ;D I was very glad to see that someone was going to get some sense in their head, and stop pushing that damn button. I mean, I'd rather blow sky-high and get it over with, than keep pushing that button.
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Post by fish1941 on Feb 9, 2006 10:35:57 GMT -5
This was a very good episode and I sense that the Lostaways' relationships with each other are beginning to unravel - think of Charlie's description of the Tailies' first 48 days as "Lord of the Flies". I realize that many are inclined to cheer Sawyer for pulling a fast one on Jack and Locke, but I simply couldn't. Yes, he pulled a great con, but to what cost? He has now alienated the Lostaways even further and his relationship with Kate is now in the doghouse. And why? All due to his pride and resentment toward the other Losties for looting his possessions . . . something he was guilty of, himself. And Charlie had sunk even lower by agreeing to participate in this con due to his own resentment toward Locke. Even though their con had been successful, I felt that Sawyer and Charlie came off as pathetic in the end.
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Post by Karen on Feb 9, 2006 10:54:41 GMT -5
Oh...my...goodness. Now, that's what I'm talkin' about! Wow! I'm in love with Charlie. I'm seriously messed up. Seriously. And Sawyer - but you all knew that already. Huh. So, now we know Charlie wasn't and hasn't been using. He's got it in so bad for Locke that he was willing to put Sun in danger. Man, Jin is going to be so pissed if he finds out. Vincent. How does he figure in there?Actually, I didn't believe Charlie when he said he didn't participate in the plan in order to get the heroin. I mean - I believe him that he did it in part to "get Locke," and I think he may believe himself, at least while he's talking. But . . . Sawyer, (so astute in the study of others that he pulled off this complex con) didn't believe Charlie, not really, and neither do I. I'm not sure whether Charlie is, was, or has been using on the Island. But he's still "under the spell" of the heroin, and that's part of what Sawyer used to get Charlie to agree to participate with the plan. Charlie lies when it comes to the heroin. I don't trust a word he says. And Vincent - good question! I'm not sure if he's a harbringer of evil or what. No doubt there is some sort of pattern to the way he shows up. I agree that Charlie is under the spell of the heroin - and that the fact of that is and has been used against him, but I do believe that he hasn't been using it since throwing it in the fire under Locke's tutelage. Now that Locke and he have had a falling out, it will be interesting to see how long he holds out against the lure of the Virgin Marys.
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Post by Karen on Feb 9, 2006 10:59:27 GMT -5
This was a very good episode and I sense that the Lostaways' relationships with each other are beginning to unravel - think of Charlie's description of the Tailies' first 48 days as "Lord of the Flies". I realize that many are inclined to cheer Sawyer for pulling a fast one on Jack and Locke, but I simply couldn't. Yes, he pulled a great con, but to what cost? He has now alienated the Lostaways even further and his relationship with Kate is now in the doghouse. And why? All due to his pride and resentment toward the other Losties for looting his possessions . . . something he was guilty of, himself. And Charlie had sunk even lower by agreeing to participate in this con due to his own resentment toward Locke. Even though their con had been successful, I felt that Sawyer and Charlie came off as pathetic in the end.They did come off as very pathetic, but oh, it was fun. I loved that last scene between Sayid and Hurley - ending with them looking up into the dark sky, and then fading into the shot of Charlie and Sawyer in the dark jungle. Very, very nice imagery. I had a question. It's been 50 days or so since Flight 815 was brought down. Do you suppose that Sawyer started a Long Con (with Kate - and probably most of the others) from the beginning?
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Post by Karen on Feb 9, 2006 11:02:26 GMT -5
It's sweeps week! ;D I was very glad to see that someone was going to get some sense in their head, and stop pushing that damn button. I mean, I'd rather blow sky-high and get it over with, than keep pushing that button. Would you keep pushing it if you thought it was saving the world? Maybe it's a counter - and experiment counter - to see how long it'd take, and what it would take, for a group to disconnect from the rest of the world and just let it all blow up.
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Post by fish1941 on Feb 9, 2006 13:14:17 GMT -5
I think the con was something that Sawyer came up with . . . after he found Jack taking the medicine from his tent.
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Post by Lola m on Feb 9, 2006 13:19:26 GMT -5
Okay, Locke is wigging me out severely. And what you want to bet that that combo won't work? And hee! on "hell, that's like getting Ghandi to beat his kids" Does anyone else thing this is a VERY BAD IDEA? **raises hand** Um, yeah!
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Post by Lola m on Feb 9, 2006 13:22:00 GMT -5
Freaky shot of the Virgin Mary's. What is Locke's problem? "Well, there are a lot of cliffs on this island, John." 7-33-13 Charlie and Sawyer. Interesting. Question of possessions. What is Sawyer's problem? Charlie and Sawyer very very interesting, now that I know how the ep ended! Oddly enough, for once I think Kate is right on the money with what Sawyer's problem is. He wants everyone to hate him. It's insane troll logic, but if he makes everyone hate him all the time, well then he can't ever lose them - lose anyone's friendship or love or whatever. Because he never had it from the start. 'Cuz sometimes he's dumber than a stump. Not to mention being a Bad Man.
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Post by Anne, Old S'cubie Cat on Feb 9, 2006 14:18:52 GMT -5
Freaky shot of the Virgin Mary's. What is Locke's problem? "Well, there are a lot of cliffs on this island, John." 7-33-13 Charlie and Sawyer. Interesting. Question of possessions. What is Sawyer's problem? Charlie and Sawyer very very interesting, now that I know how the ep ended! Oddly enough, for once I think Kate is right on the money with what Sawyer's problem is. He wants everyone to hate him. It's insane troll logic, but if he makes everyone hate him all the time, well then he can't ever lose them - lose anyone's friendship or love or whatever. Because he never had it from the start. 'Cuz sometimes he's dumber than a stump. Not to mention being a Bad Man. Somewhere deep inside, Sawyer is still an insecure little boy. Cookie dough.
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Post by Sue on Feb 9, 2006 15:58:10 GMT -5
Please excuse my denseness, but my video tape was very dark and I wasn't paying close attention.
What happened at the very end in the pre-Island con?
Partner threatened Sawyer. Sawyer went to girl, said he loved her and sent her elsewhere to wait for him. Went out to the car. Who was in driver's seat? I couldn't see. Then went back inside? And picked up another/different bag of money?
Can someone give me the bare bones of who wound up with what and how?
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Post by Karen on Feb 9, 2006 17:01:59 GMT -5
Please excuse my denseness, but my video tape was very dark and I wasn't paying close attention. What happened at the very end in the pre-Island con? Partner threatened Sawyer. Sawyer went to girl, said he loved her and sent her elsewhere to wait for him. Went out to the car. Who was in driver's seat? I couldn't see. Then went back inside? And picked up another/different bag of money? Can someone give me the bare bones of who wound up with what and how? I am somewhat confused, too, but this is what my friend and I came up with. Sawyer's partner wanted Sawyer to close the deal. Sawyer balked, partner figured Sawyer fell for the girl, and Sawyer let him believe that. Partner threatened girl and Sawyer. Sawyer told the girl that the partner threatened them both, gave her a bag of mostly newspaper and sent her off to wait for him. Sawyer went back to the vehicle -where his partner never was in the first place. Counted to 10 -or so - went back in and picked up the bag of real money that he had stashed somehow (have to rewatch to see how he did this). What we figured is that he conned them both - and had planned to from the beginning. Someone else might have seen this differently. Heck, I might even see it differently on the rewatch.
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Post by Lola m on Feb 9, 2006 17:32:06 GMT -5
Love the framing of the powwow on the beach. Lots of camera work to heighten tension and emphasize suspicion of everyone in this ep. I would not be surprised if that played a part in it.
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Post by Lola m on Feb 9, 2006 17:36:24 GMT -5
Five blades. Plus an extra on the back. Is the Gillette 72 far behind? Ah, the scott/steve joke. And the suspicion has passed on to Jack, too. Gotta be some trust SOMEWHERE. Definitely a "lord of the flies" kind of ep. Not a lot of trust from anyone to anyone. Small clumps or pairs of people banding together for the moment or because of a close tie or mutual benefit. Shifting allegiences and so on. How about Flash-er? ;D ;D ;D This is what I kept thinking. And actuall I was suspicious of her because she figured out his con. Loved loved loved that line. ;D That was my first thought too! I loved how it turned out to be other way around. Fit nicely into the "who's conning who" vibe of the flash er-back.
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