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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 20:28:16 GMT -5
Topic area devoted to Spikaholics, Spuffyites, Spike shippers of all types, plus any James Marsters information. All information on relationships, behavior, physical/mental/emotional/spiritual qualities of Spike or JM welcome. Straying off topic not a problem here. Share your knowledge, insights, observations, speculations, or other information on our favorite character in or out of any episode. See also "All Things Spike/James Marsters" (Parts 1-5) farther down the Miscellaneous Board.
Alexandra K.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:02:00 GMT -5
In the episode "The Initiative" the soldiers took temperature readings of Spike when he was in Buffy and Willow's dorm room. His body was 'room temperature', circa 65 or so, whereas Willow's temperature was 98.6.
I have also watched several episodes where Spike and the female du jour are ensconced under some type of covering in bed. Under a gold quilt with Harmony ("Family"), under a rug with Buffy ("Dead Things?") , and under a blanket with Buffy in "As You Were". Not to mention the sheet covering Spike and invisi-Buffy in "Gone". Spike also had bed covers on his bed with Dru. And there were covers on Angel's bed too.
My question is - why do vampires need blankets if they don't get warm anyway? If Spike or Angel was with Buffy I could understand the covers; she needed to keep warm. With Harmony and Dru it doesn't make sense.
Something to make the surface soft to sleep ON, but not to keep warm. If vampires take on the temperature of their surroundings, is there a specific temperature below which they would be uncomfortable?
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:09:49 GMT -5
I've always just decided that this was going to be one of those things we need to supsend disbelief on. Other examples include School Hard: Drusilla shivers and Spike looks at her with concern and then takes off his coat and puts it around her shoulders. If she had no body heat, how would this help? After some thought I've come up with a new theory that they get heat from feeding, enough to keep themselves somewhat warmer than the air outside, and that it is mystically enhanced to last longer than it would in the real world but if they don't get new blood from feeding enough, then, having no internal heat source they will equalize with the atmosphere eventually. Also that they prefer not to get too cold. Spike hadn't had anything but what the inititive had fed him for days, which was probably cold, so he was already at room temperature. I've also decided that Spike must generally microwave his blood lately, so that he hasn't been a full thirty or forty degrees colder than Buffy during all of their activities. Please don't tell me if this theory doesn't work.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:17:54 GMT -5
When Ford shook hands with Angel in "Lie to Me", he mentioned how cold Angel's hand was. And didn't Xander make some reference to Spike's cold marble body in some episode? Apparently being very cold is just normal for the vampires. I'm beginning to see that Buffy really needed those blankets.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:25:46 GMT -5
(This is an historic post.)
Spring said:
"I vote for staying on the more heavily trafficked "Misc Board". Our discussions (almost) always involve Spike, but really, they are pretty far-ranging in the sense that they delve into the storylines, character developments, metaphors, analysis of various types. So, I'd like to just keep going as we have - Part 3, 4, 5. . . etc. I like the idea of more people seeing it and possibly contributing, etc."
I agree with Spring. I think things have just been going swimmingly as they have been. Moving us to the ghost town that is "Stars" would simply cause the numbers of new posters to dwindle, and I suppose also the number of semi-regulars.
As far as receiving our own section of the BTVS board, well, personally I don't think we need it. What we have here is a grass roots posting area. We staked out (pardon the pun) our own area and laid claim to it. Well, actually, I didn't. I was a Johnny Come Lately. But I feel like I have been adopted.
And as Nan said ATS/jm #5 Post #36:
"...this feels more and more like home.I may not leave except at gunpoint."
Let me say in conclusion on this topic that I feel that moving would be harmful to what is currently a growing, thriving concern. The only thing I can see served by it is a form of recognition, sort of a "See how important we are!" Well, I for one, think we don't need that exterior confirmation. We already know what a great thing we got going.
Now, as far as terms: When I read Alex's suggestion, I actually started laughing out loud.
" Suggested name instead of Spikoholics or Spikettes: the Soulful Spike Society, building on our Linguistics Chair's suggestion of the Soulful Society. (We could call ourselves 'S' Cubed, or the SCubies.)*Grin*" -- Alexandra
I love the name "The Soulful Spike Society" and the term "The S'cubies." I am still chuckling as I write this. I think the title for the group is succinct in describing what this area is about and non-gender specific.(I am sure that Robert feels as I do about the importance of this *G*) And the nickname for the members is equisitely punful. A perfect example of the intelligence inherent in the members.
My vote definitely lies with The Soulful Spike Society and the monicker "the S'cubies (or just "Scubies"). I would like to second Alex's motion to call the board The Soulful Spike Society and call for a vote. Perhaps the next board could be called just that with maybe a paranthetical:
The Soulful Spike Society (formerly known as ATS/JM).
Eventually we could drop the ATS/JM.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:27:11 GMT -5
I agree with vlad imp. The Soulful Spike Society. Why didn't I put the Spike in there in the first place? I should point out however that I am not the chair in Linguistics, that position is already capably occupied. I'm just a gal who was freezing her tushie off and had to keep her mind occupied. Thinking up names was just a way of keeping the gears turning.
Now, the question is, how do we want to spell the abreviation?
SCubies, S'cubies or some other variation. I kind of like the appostrophe vlad added. Alexandra, this is the absolute best abreviated name anyone could have come up with. THhe SSS just doesn't look right.
Signing off,
M.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:29:24 GMT -5
Just as I kept warm yesterday by keeping the gears moving, I submit that vampires may warm up by moving. Vamps must somehow metabolize their food, and since chemical reactions are seldom (never) perfect, waste heat is generated. Many chemical reactions are exothermic, and certainly metabolism is such, so the simple act of taking in food and the chemical reactions that ensue would serve to warm a vampire by several degrees. Further, the simple act of moving, would in itself generate waste heat. As such, although they may not be at 96.7 deg, they would most certainly be above room temperature at least by a few degrees. Maybe they attempt to maitain the little heat they have managed to gain during their waking hours, by wrapping up at night (sorry, I mean day).
Of course that doesn't explain why vampires go mad when they don't feed for a long time. Or does it?
Well, that is the Chemical Engineering perspective, am I missing some massive gap in my logic? If so please bring it up. I could amend my reasoning.
M.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:31:26 GMT -5
My take on the blankets is that vampires tend to cling to their mortal coil. They are dead, but aren't. They think, they feel, and , at least in Spike's case, they love. I kind of look at the blanket as being a psychological response.
In fact, look at the vampires we are discussing here. They aren't the sub-intelligent vampire henches. These are the main guys. The thinking vampires. Angel tries to live among the living. Spike does the same. So, psycologiclaly, when they go to sleep, they want a blanket.
Personally, even on a hot summer night, I usually prefer to be covered by at least a sheet. There is just something about the protection it provides to your otherwise vulnerable self. And vampires, who are rather invulnerable while awake, are at their absolute weakest while they sleep, usually during the one time when the very daylight could be their death. Personally, I think it's a wonder they don't all sleep with a heavy wool blanket pulled over their heads. *L*
Also, I like what watergal said about it helping retain a little of that stored up heat. Us mortals do the same with our blankets and sheets as our body temps drop a couple degrees as we sleep also.
So, all in all, I don't think it completely uncharacteristic that vamps would use sheets and blankets to sleep.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:33:58 GMT -5
It always made sense to me that the heterothermic (cold-blooded) vampires of Jossverse use blankets, coats etc... to warm themselves up to a comfortable temperature. Just because they have no internal thermostat doesn't mean that they aren't more comfortable at a warmer temperature, does it?
Heterothermic animals will vary their activity level according to temperature. When cold their activity levels drop. When warm they are at their most active. They often will bask in the sun to increase their body temperatures. Sun bathing is not an option but dressing appropriately for weather and covering up with sheets and blankets when sleeping can help them achieve a more comfortable body temperature.
Whenever I see Spike sleeping under, or barely under, a thin sheet, my first thought is, isn't he cold? Why isn't he using a blanket? I'm all for seeing Spike's beatuiful physique but only when it doesn't jar my suspension of disbelief. I don't need gratuitous exposure, thank you.
I wonder if JW has had any regrets about some of the physiological peculiarities he established for his vampires early on in the series. It seems to me that the only function he really thought about in advance was the ability of male vampires to have an erection; we've all heard that anectdote about Joss having said something like "If my male vampires can't get an erection then I won't have a show." But the rest of it; e.g., cold bloodedness, not breathing, no blood circulation, are commonly just ignored by ME because these silly limitations get in the way of their stories. On the one hand, they have Angel being unable to revive Buffy w/ mouth to mouth recessitation but yet they show him exhaling on Giles' glasses to clean them. They supposedly don't have circulation but they bruise. They don't need air yet are often seen out panting and out of breath following exertion and are tortured by being held under water. These, to name a few, are issues that I must keep confined behind walls of mental blocks so that they can't get in the way of my enjoyment of the show.
And speaking of dressing appropriately for the weather, the humans characters often display an extreme range of dress in the same scene that defys logic and leaves me shaking my head in disbelief, (as well as trying to shake the disbelief out of my head and move on). For example, there have been scenes with Willow dressed in a sweater and tights while Buffy wears a skimpy halter top and sports bare legs. One of the best examples of this phenomenon is in OMWF during the big number when they're all converging on the Bronze to rescue Dawn. Buffy and Spike are both wearing leather coats. Willow is wearing a sweater coat, Tara is in a sweater and long skirt, Giles and Xander are wearing jackets and Anya is wearing a sleeveless summer dress. What's the weather supposed to be anyway?
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:35:19 GMT -5
My vote goes to The Soulful Spike Society (or/and?) The S'cubies. With or without the apostrophe is fine with me.
I also would prefer to stay on Misc rather than moving to Stars/Characters. The more heavily trafficked Misc provides better exposure and those coming to the Misc Board for any other reason cannot help but notice us and be impressed and probably intrigued by our numbers.
Personally, I was considering staying right here to discuss the next episode rather than moving over to Episodes unless everyone else shifts over. Up through "Showtime" I've always posted there for general episode discussion but I just stopped monitering the "Showtime Episode" topic when the volume reached 300 or so. It got so very repetitive and time consuming that I decided it just wasn't worth it, I'd rather spend my limited time trying to keep with ATS/JM. Is there really don't any point to posting there anymore? Aren't there enough of us here to have a really good discussion among ourselves?
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:36:27 GMT -5
I think we do have enough for a good discussion group here, and I plan to keep checking in here when the new episode airs, but I like the Episode board too, and since my capacity for attending to Buffy boards instead of my actual life is tremendous, I think I'll be able to do both just fine.
The nice thing about this board, (other than the Spike love, of course) is that it's okay to stray into other subjects, but I feel guilty when I find myself getting into other subjects on the Episode board, which I inevitabley seem to do. Which is part of why I vote for staying on Miscellaneous too.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:38:10 GMT -5
...speaking of dressing appropriately for the weather, the humans characters often display an extreme range of dress in the same scene that defys logic and leaves me shaking my head in disbelief... :
Let me see. I live in Texas. Right now the temperature is about 65 degrees. I'm wearing a long sleeved shirt and jeans and I'm freezing. Last night I went out and the temperature was about 55 degrees. I wore similar clothes and was perfectly comfortable.
Point is, sometimes an individual reacts differently to external temperatures than at other times. That statement becomes even more true when you include more than one individual. Or haven't you ever seen that guy on the coldest day of the year running around happily in shirtsleeves?
My take is that, as in everything else, vampires vary on their reaction to external temperatures. Just because cold doesn't kill them or make them sick doesn't mean that it's always comfortable for them. And sometimes, like humans, they wear what they want regardless of the comfort factor.
Re: Anya's sundress in OMWF, she probably either wanted to wear that particular dress that day regardless of the temperature, or she's less sensitive to cold than the other Scoobies.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:39:43 GMT -5
Don't care what board we're on. Whither thou goest... etc.
I like this board. Unlike Episodes, absolutely NOTHING is off-limits, relardless how silly it is.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:41:31 GMT -5
OK. If we are going with the Soulful Spike Society, then I would suggest changing the ATS/JM header to “The Soulful Spike Society – Part 7 (a continuation of the “All things Spike/JM discussions)” next time we move up the Misc Board.
Then, when we get to part 8, we drop the parenthesis with the explanation, and just go with “The Soulful Spike Society - Part 8”.
I think Alexandra’s “first post opener” should remain basically the same, except for adding a line explaining the name – something like: “Posters to this board refer to themselves as “Scubies” – pronounced “Skew-bees”. This refers to the Society’s initials “SSS”, or “S cubed”, and of course, it also pays homage to the Scoobies!”
Marvelously clever thinking, Alexandra!
Reading everyone’s comments, I do think it is actually better to stay on the Misc board than get shuffled off to some corner. We are likely to get more notice and traffic if we stay here.
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Post by Dalton on Jun 26, 2003 22:43:39 GMT -5
To quote William, “I prefer not to think of such ugly things”. I just tell myself that the Initiative had faulty equipment and that Spike temperature is always around 98.5. Otherwise, I would have to re-evaluate Spike’s assessment of what “made her scream” when he replied to Buffy’s “You’re bent” comment. Bent? Who would even notice if the temperature was 70 degrees? Yikes!!
The show has always played fast and loose with this concept. Buffy touches Angel’s without realizing he’s a vampire, etc. So I say keep your fantasies nice and warm and cozy and go with 98.5 – it's just right.
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